Notices by Jeramee (jeramee@mastodon.social), page 2

@AnarchoNinaWrites

I'd like to introduce you to @HistoPol

They are a cool, thoughtful person looking to improve their debate-jutsu.

You're great at taking the offense, and often drop nuggets of capitalism's fascistic history that are deeply enlightening.

I think you two will get along well.

@JuliusGoat

A great piece that also points out a consistent failing: don't let conservatives keep changing the subject. That's their fire hose of BS tactic.

You may have to remind a conservative that conversations can only happen when civil and that it's rude to continuously ignore your interlocutor's question, and that, to maintain any credibility, he needs to answer the question.

In my experience, conservatives will get mad and leave rather than answer honestly.

@whatzaname @theogrin @migriverat @lillyfinch @JuliusGoat

Facts. People are allowed their own opinions, not their own facts. It's ok to say that something isn't true, esp when you can provide a link\cite\ evidence.

If they go off on conspiracies, request them to provide facts and dismantle them, but one at a time. You can require them to acknowledge a disproved fact before continuing, otherwise they are simply delusional & there's no point continuing.

Let's Assume It's True is a good 2\x

@whatzaname @theogrin @migriverat @lillyfinch @JuliusGoat
Focus, Facts, Space, & Questions.

First, remember that tone is often misinterpreted with text. Review what you write b4 posting, imagine how it could be misread, & adjust.

Focus on one issue. The bamboozled will switch topics as a defense mechanism when you begin to show their ideas are bad. MAGA deflect as a technique to dominate. Refuse to deviate, if for no other reason than to drive MAGA insane, but also to focus on reality.

1\x

@whatzaname @theogrin @migriverat @lillyfinch @JuliusGoat

Space cont'd. Make up an excuse to step away from the conversation temporarily, if needed, to give the other person time to calm down. Don't be afraid to apologize & restate a comment that was misinterpreted.

Questions. Learn to focus on using questions. Ask the other person to explain what they mean, or why X is important, or why they believe Y is true. (Seek first to understand, then to be understood).

Socratic Questions. 4\x

@whatzaname @theogrin @migriverat @lillyfinch @JuliusGoat
Let's Assume It's True is a good technique. Assume the claim is true, then follow its logic until it disproves itself. Beau of the 5th Column on YouTube is great at this.

Space. Control the space. If additional people are commenting, it's ok to ask them to refrain to keep a calmer, less confrontational conversation. (You may want to ask them through private message, at your discretion.)

Also, you can pause the conversation. 3\x

@whatzaname @theogrin @migriverat @lillyfinch @JuliusGoat

@HistoPol
Is this thread helpful?

@whatzaname @theogrin @migriverat @lillyfinch @JuliusGoat
Socratic Questions. This technique is about using dialogue to find truth. It often entails asking questions about small details to help the other person find the truth through their own answers. With my students, I often feel like my questions are just stairs: each one is necessary to climb before the next, and each takes them a bit closer to the answer.

Reality. We can't reach everyone. Don't fear leaving toxic relationships.

5\end.

@HistoPol
The first time I was exposed to the idea was from The History Guy on YT. (Below)

The US has literally fought wars & launched coups to dominate workers on banana plantations. This is where Banana Republic coffee from: a derogatory term for a nation under US imperial domination through neo-colonialism.

There are some other amazing videos of you search Banana Wars on YT.

https://youtu.be/h8vTt9Y1mkQ?si=PPaa6AGZ-ROcOQr4

@HistoPol
Have you met @indyradio yet?

They have helped me learn more about the misdeeds of our govt. I think you two will get along like 2 peas in a pod.

@HistoPol

Btw, I appreciate your civility here. You could have dismissed my prior comment, but instead asked for clarification so we could have a further dialogue.

If only liberals were half as civil as you.....

@HistoPol
If it was taken out at the behest of big oil, then Hersh's reporting tracks.

I'm sure you're aware of the Banana Wars, waged for the benefit of US corporate plantation owners. And, of course, the Afghanistan & Iraq wars were waged for oil.

We have a long history of using the military to benefit corporate profits margins.

@HistoPol

Yes, and more than just a revenue stream - it was a bargaining chip.

Putin may be evil, but he ain't stupid. Do you know any chess players that would just take one of their bishops of the board? That would be the equivalent of Russia taking out the pipeline.

@HistoPol

To be fair, the military has a history of stoking bigotry. How many slurs of foreign soldiers can you think of?

To be fair to the soldiers, though, it's much easier to murder after you've dehumanized the victims.

Yeah, Flynn is definitely adding to the problem.

We'd be better off to listen to Gen Smedley Butler: "War is a racket."

@HistoPol

LA area police depts have been under multiple different consent decrees, but there are still constant reports of abuse, including reports of multiple death gangs operating in the sheriff's dept today.

If this level of bigotry exists here at home, can we really expect the Nazis & white supremacists to leave their bigotry at the door when they join the military - or is it more likely that the Nazism grows & spreads to the rest of the force?

https://www.npr.org/2022/03/25/1088905429/lasd-gangs-investigation-los-angeles

@HistoPol
Yes.
Your question shows motive.
Hersh's report shows method.
We all saw what happened after the opportunity arose.

@HistoPol

I don't call them Nazis bc of a crime of aggression (aka a crime against humanity) but because the Nazis have always been there. I read a CIA doc that listed some of the Nazi leaders, like Stepan Bandera, who Azov idolizes & the CIA supported for years.

US media used to report on the Nazis in Ukraine until the war started.

We know from home, authoritarian institutions don't cull bigotry, they metastasize it.
1\n

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/

@HistoPol

Btw I don't claim to be an expert in this area. Just relaying a different perspective i saw.

@HistoPol

I watched a YT news program from Africa with (I think) hosts from Niger. They explained that the coup was bc France still controlled their financial system, aka colonialism 3.0. While 1\3 light bulbs in France are powered by Niger's uranium, most of their homes lack electricity. This colonialism is the context where Wagner operates.

Also a host mentioned that Wagner's activities are against mid-east insurgents created by US wars who went to Africa.

@HistoPol

Re: Nordstream

Either US or Ukraine. Hersh reported it was the US, & he has a track record of exposing US lies. Plus, many US officials publicly threatened that pipeline.

I don't trust Putin, but he's not stupid enough to blow up his money line. Plus, if it were intact, it'd give him negotiation leverage.

I saw the story pointing at Ukraine, but that indicated they would've needed US assistance to pull it off.