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@ryanc @kajer @cR0w so... you got paged about a machine that was not even online.

That is just concerning.

@ryanc @kajer @cR0w ...

@ryanc @kajer @cR0w ... and the one who had to fix that was not the one who managed the compliance tool

But you

@ryanc @kajer @cR0w So you got paged because a compliance tool installed, then failed to maintain a software you don't even need???

@Li @corbet While I will not pretend it's impossible for the mouse to win this game, what you describe seems a few noches above what Graphine probably provides.

The point I make is less "The victim couldn't make this a problem" and more "The cops complaining they were given a durress code is a sign that they were already breaking the law and procedure".

Hey no one let me miss the Nightmare Eclipse drama coming today please

@aral If I may point out - you have just decided to put me on blast to your followers for...

Pointing out that I have no way to tell whether a stranger with a website is trustworthy.

@cian @aral My pleasantness runs out fast when guilt trips start.

@paddyduke @aral @bifouba You say that as if we didn't have an anti-LGBT group set up a scam asking for donations on behalf of LGBT people.

Would you really feel comfortable knowing your $25 meant to go towards helping someone went towards hurting them?

You also say that as if the act of paying online is a safe and private affair, rather than one that gives the recipient a surprising amount of information that can be misused by either the recipient or a middleman. The risk is not just $25.

We need better solutions than this. Ones that are distinguishable from scams in a real and auditable way. Ones that correctly limit exposure to individuals. Ones where a donator is guaranteed not to be flooded in even more requests for help the way my grandma is when she financially supports the democrats.

This is a system level issue. It needs a system level solution.

@bifouba @aral I don't really think that's the logic.

Gazans are a very visibly desperate group that no one can question need help, but also that no one has the tools to actually verify.

If I were a scammer, that's exactly who I would want to be impersonating.

@soatok @EatingHawaiianP1zza What I think has partially driven this is a lack of independent spaces. Pubs are good for drinking related socialization, but when there is no space for sober socualization, people... get mad at the pubs for the lack of milkshake bars? Not because they are wrong to want something else from their spaces, but because they can't consieve of having a milkshake bar as a distinct option.

What AOL, Google, and others did was make most of the internet into a single space. It's one of same flaws in Social Media that causes frequent ugly clashing.

Spaces have different rules.

Spaces have different priorities.

Spaces have different communities and managers.

Spaces can be gatekept without individuals being left in the cold, because there are many gates available.

But force everyone into a single space all the time, and the rule set won't work for everyone.

@tillshadeisgone @CaribenxMarciaX i think... there's somethign missing to this conversation.

I can't speek for others on other platforms, but... a lot of the FediBlock reminds me of lgbt discourse on Tumblr from back in the day.

Let me tell you, the results from that are ugly. Very Ugly.

It tore communities apart - especially the ones with well meaning users. Important topics would become taboo because no one could be sure if their perspective was "pure" enough. People would dogpile users, and the evidence of what actually started the attacks would simply vanish, either because OP deleted it, or because there were just... so many angry comments. Instigators would make accounts and make bad faith arguments, which caused a lot of confusion.

When I say it was ugly, I mean it was ugly.

Communities did not survive.Good friends stopped talking to each other, even when they weren't on different sides.

Hell, people would wind up on the wrong side of arguments because the conversation would have twisted so much!

These were people who didn't have a great foundation to begin with - people who still needed to learn the basics of this conversation. Of course they'd be easy to lead astray. To manipulate.

And then there were the blocklists.

Unvetted. From strangers on the internet. No evidence needed.

Of course they were abused.

but crucially

No one was protected by this. No one was helped. There weren't deeper understandings fostered, and like hell did anyone have the ability to actually protect anyone else! What benefit even was there to all that ugglyness? I can't think of any.

The only way out of that constant uglyness is to disengage from it. So that's what a lot of people did - to varying degrees.

Many left Tumblr all together. Others stayed, but largely fell silent.

As you can imagine, it's not an erra I'd like to see repeated.

@patrickcmiller If they were inevitable, WE WOULD NOT HAVE BUILT THEM THIS WAY.

@ryanc Both are usually locked behind a barrier. The diode at least bothers to let you know something is wrong when it is hidden away.

@dalias I suspect the problem is not the"field of journalism", but rather the builsness of journalism.

The reason Substack is successful (forgive me), is because it is giving journalists a path to a different buisness model. Ignoring what we all know is coming, that's... actually quite critical.

Part of our probme might be that we don't have people who are more ethical doing the dirty work and the propoganda work needed to establish a buisness and a market for a journalism platform.

We, people who know exactly where this is heading, know that "platforms" are ripe for abuse. Theproblem though, is that the platform users are genuinely benefitting from having the Level Of Service that the platform provides.

A journalist, when doing the work they actually signed up to do, will be too busy journalisming to be managing mailing lists, serveruptime, payment platforms, etc.

Seen that way... I think we have a massive social problem that needs some technical support.

I do not have the social solution.

@Gargron @codemonkeymike @aglimme If this was really about theft, then a user with a stolen macbook would be able to use it to contact the owners for purposes of return.

@dalias I certainly notice how people going off about QC are almost entirely uninterested in the very real issues with MFA and device beased authentication. In fact... I have noticed it seems almost exclusively used to either distract from more present security problems or to advertise passkeys.

@divVerent @dalias why isn't it going to happen?

We are in a bad spot now, but... the bubble is popping. A bubble that pretty much all of survailence capitalism is involved in.

Politically things are heating up.

The USA's control is also breaking across the world.

Pretty much all the major companies are involved with a single scandal that is shaking up leadership in several places.

People are actively pushing back against Ring and tearing down Flock cameras in a push agaiinst survailence capitalism.

With such a turbulant time, why couldn't we successfullly land in a space where abusive platforms are banned and a minimum standard of behavior is established?

@joeo10 Can't say too much, but it's not just consumer focused companies feeling the pinch.

@evan Okay I have used word but please understand

Work.