Notices by cajax (cajax@clubcyberia.co)
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@bot what do you mean?
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@bot idk I keep getting in arguments that feel kinda empty afterward
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@D00B @Wild_West @grips @Junes @bot cool is she still a kitten?
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@bot @Wild_West @grips @Junes @D00B like persian people or persian cats?
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@J @hidden @une @snacks Very interesting shit. I had to go and get high in the mean time (had a productive day damnit it's earned) so I'm not in a great disposition to really argue about this but I'll be thinking about it and maybe I'll have something to say later.
But I do have a couple questions in the meantime...
>Christians have been spending the past 1900 years or so coping; stuck in an impossible situation
Are you saying that christianity, in the formulation passed down to us, was kind of intended as a stop-gap for a short period of time? That kind of... sheds a lot of light on problems I've had with this religion in the past.
>because you'll find that he frequently doesn't meet his own criteria for good
I was under the impression that under christian doctrine god was basically allowed to break his own rules. some people say it's because he's completely above our judgement entirely, others say the stuff he did was justified on moral grounds, or even that the people he punished were "predestined" to be damned (if you wanna give calvinists any creedence-- personally I find them absolutely disgusting).
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@J @hidden @une @snacks well in order to literally "break [its] own rules" a god has to have contradictory, unpraiseworthy traits, or just be kind of stupid and unable to plan ahead-- i.e., not godlike. So it's kind of a self-contradictioin.
I think it comes down to the fact that we have a natural disdain for that kind of behavior. Leaders who commanded you to do one thing while they did the opposite are extremely dangerous to have over you. Maybe God is just a more intense projection of the normal roles we have such as 'leader' or 'father,' so we find those traits abhorrent in Him. Completely understandable to not like that about christianity IMO, I agree.
Sorry man I'm probably dragging this discussion way off topic. I'll fuck off until I'm sober.
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i rarely talk to people I like on here anymore
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@creamqueen @georgia it's just a goatse reference
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@hidden @J @une @snacks how do you think jung missed the mark?
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@hidden @J @une @snacks I don't know it's possible for me to ever say you're right or wrong, Jung's way too complicated. I just think I see different things from you. When you get deep into Jung, at least for me, that "flexible ego" thing is exactly how I started seeing it.
Like, you can have a certain trait, like a short temper for example, but you realize that it's just an aspect of your internal mental world that you can identify with or regard as just a feature of your "landscape." It's something shared by many many other people, and in that way it's not really "you", but you can apply the wisdom of people who have had to deal with the same kind of thing before to your own problems.
He says a lot of things out of nowhere, like, "when you realize who you really are, all of this will be obvious." And these phrases stick out, and they're confusing. I think with passages like that he's hinting at something very deep with plausible deniability that he meant it as anything other than, in this example, "knowing who you really are" is just knowing your own internal landscape, and not... something else. I don't know, honestly, I just have a feeling there's a lot of other stuff there you can't really see unless you're ready for it.
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@J @hidden @une @snacks ah, that sounds a little like evola
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@J @hidden @une @snacks well Jung was influenced by nietzche, and nietzsche made a really good argument that the christian orthodoxy was kind of tainted at its foundation-- for example, that it glorified abstaining from the use of power, which most of its followers weren't in any position to indulge in anyway. It's a kind of a "cheap" religion that way.
Also, something that bothers me immensely about christianity is that it promulgates a kind of false unity, that the christian god is THE final embodiment of all the important, ultimate forces, and that there's nothing else. It does give SOME nods to jesus' human nature and his struggles with that, but overall, the story isn't exactly close to the lives of normal people. It's not easy to RELATE to. It kind of has a tendency to float away, and leave people utterly void of spiritual experience outside of the two hours every sunday. It leads people to completely exclude the sublime from any part of their day-to-day lives. As if they're thinking "yeah that's God shit, nothing to do with me!" when the reality is that everyone is meant to seek a connection with something like the divine.
It makes perfect sense for people to want to stay away from that rigid order, but yeah that's no excuse for most hippies and other "free thinkers" or wahtever not filling the resulting gaps with SOMETHING other than just primitive nature worship bs, or better yet updating christianity.
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@snacks @hidden @une but it does most of the time. Usually when it doesn't it's because there's something you're not aware of (or don't want to be aware of) that you need to acknowledge. Only then can you negotiate with it.
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@waifu @worldisrotting lol did it have an influence on you?
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@snacks @hidden @une it's possible to exert a good deal more control than you'd think, the only thing is you can't dictate your emotions or control them through force. You have to reason with yourself.
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@Forestofenchantment @Doll @Folklore @IAMAL_PHARIUS @iska no idea who that is
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@Doll @Folklore @IAMAL_PHARIUS >he thinks cats are real
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@Doll @Folklore @IAMAL_PHARIUS they ALL believe the lies
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@bot @creamqueen @anemone @mia @meso @teratology well, making their kids hang out with dangerous third worlders who hate them is kind of the liberal MO so... yeah, that may be a non-starter in places like western europe
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@waifu @lain @anemone @deadheat @nerthos especially when she's having cognitive dissonance.
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cajax
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