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1. Embed this notice
   Eugen Rochko (gargron@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:14:45 JST Eugen Rochko

   • かき@GNUsocialJP

   If Meta is really working on a new ActivityPub-powered social network, I see it as a very positive signal overall--my personal feelings towards Meta notwithstanding. For one, it's validation for our entire ecosystem from the biggest player. It also tells me that they don't see themselves as strong enough to keep users locked inside their walled garden anymore. It means the tide is really turning for interoperable social media, and that's always been the goal.

   • clacke likes this.
   • clacke repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     Chris Trottier (atomicpoet@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:16:57 JST Chris Trottier

     in reply to

     @Gargron My thoughts exactly. They see the future and they know it's not walled gardens.

     More to the point, just because they're Meta doesn't mean they'll be successful.

     Kodak was an early adopter of digital cameras, but they went bankrupt.

     Why? Because they just couldn't leave film photography behind.

     藤井太洋, Taiyo Fujii repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     David Pollak (dpp@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:20:29 JST David Pollak

     in reply to

     @Gargron please be aware of and careful about embrace and extend… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish

   • Embed this notice
     Chloe Tse :BlobhajSadReach: (chloetse@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:23:48 JST Chloe Tse :BlobhajSadReach:

     in reply to

     @Gargron if there is anything positive coming out of the bird site burning down, it's this! Such a great win for ActivityPub and the philosophy behind it!

   • Embed this notice
     Freakinbox (freakinbox@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:28:14 JST Freakinbox

     in reply to

     @Gargron Meta has been hemorrhaging users for a few years now. Like Twitter it has tried to wall people off then suggesting they pay to promote themselves... and like Twitter... they are learning you don't have content creators when you force such things.

     IMO, if they don't adapt they will stop existing.

     Bots make up a lot of their interactions there now. Much like we see with Twitter.

   • Embed this notice
     DJGummikuh (djgummikuh@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:28:55 JST DJGummikuh

     in reply to

     @Gargron Let's hope they'er not trying to subverse ActivitPub by flooding it with custom "improvements" :S

   • Embed this notice
     Eleanor (kd0bpv@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:30:24 JST Eleanor

     in reply to

     @Gargron
     Just keep in mind the strategy these corporations employ: Embrace, Extend, Extinguish.

   • Embed this notice
     Scott Dickson (scott_d@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:36:40 JST Scott Dickson

     in reply to

     @Gargron I agree it’s a good thing with only a few minor reservations. On the plus side, all those folks who got on Mastodon but then didn’t find their friends and left will have more of a reason to stick around. Their friends may just show up via Meta.

   • Embed this notice
     Jack Yan (甄爵恩) (jackyan@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:37:25 JST Jack Yan (甄爵恩)

     in reply to

     @Gargron Whatever they do, I wonʼt be jumping on board to their version.
     Also itʼs not 2007. Their time has long passed.

   • Embed this notice
     YurkshireLad (yurkshirelad@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:47:30 JST YurkshireLad

     in reply to

     @Gargron I suppose meta could create their own gigantic (and modified) Mastodon instance and brand it as Facebook. They may even try to contribute to Mastodon’s source code and ultimately try to steer its development in whatever direction they want.

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     Jim Parsons (tryshhq@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 08:55:22 JST Jim Parsons

     in reply to

     • John Gruber

     @Gargron while I'm with both you & @gruber on rolling out welcome mat for #Zuckstick + #Meta in #Fediverse serious concerns remain re: establishing “Digital Self Defence” tools, strategies, policies & laws re: persistent #PersonalData harvesting by #BigTech everywhere Zeros & Ones exist. Where's the balance between Open Web & Privacy? We have TONS of great #digital stuff precisely because there’s NO law or BAD law (especially in #AI).
     Asking for citizens, individuals families & #democracy ?

   • Embed this notice
     Terci (terci@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 09:02:17 JST Terci

     in reply to

     @Gargron They're gonna "embrace, extend, extinguish" lol

   • Embed this notice
     知耻而未勇 (shqm2@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 09:18:28 JST 知耻而未勇

     in reply to

     @Gargron “去中心化”、“保护多元”，被你这样有志向、有宽容，而且有能力的人所坚守着，是“胜者通吃”时代的清流。
     谢谢。

     "Decentralization" and "protection of diversity", which are upheld by ambitious, tolerant, and capable people like you, are the clear stream of the "winner takes all" era.
     Thanks.

   • Embed this notice
     Rythur (rythur@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 09:39:05 JST Rythur

     in reply to

     @Gargron The one thing they may not be considering fully is that these things were created as a way to get away from them in the first place. I don't see their dynasty lasting so dynastically.

   • Embed this notice
     Dawn Tåke ?️‍⚧️ (tourma@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 09:52:33 JST Dawn Tåke ?️‍⚧️

     in reply to

     @Gargron
     Isn't the EU talking about forcing interoperability? Might just be trying to get ahead of the curve.

     Still, good.

   • Embed this notice
     Jesse Karmani (jesseplusplus@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 10:38:50 JST Jesse Karmani

     in reply to

     @Gargron yes!! that's the dream! I have plenty of family who will stay on facebook until it dies, no matter what I say to them... I would love to still be able to share with them and see their updates via ActivityPub

   • Embed this notice
     GravyPouch (gravypouch@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 10:39:53 JST GravyPouch

     in reply to

     @Gargron It will also be great to have all their engineers improving the standard.

   • Embed this notice
     zdfs (zdfs@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 10:51:43 JST zdfs

     in reply to

     @Gargron Do not underestimate their ability to destroy anything that threatens them.

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Amber Grey (ambergrey@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 11:05:22 JST Amber Grey

     in reply to

     @Gargron love that perspective. :blobcatcoffee:

   • Embed this notice
     Ben Zanin (gnomon@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 11:56:53 JST Ben Zanin

     in reply to

     @Gargron "and also when they show up we're going to block them like a cat running full tilt into a glass patio door", yeah?

   • Embed this notice
     zeruch (zeruch@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 12:03:43 JST zeruch

     in reply to

     @Gargron I'm not 100% on board here; I see this as much an opportunistic move to siphon Twitter down, nip Blue Sky AND possibly attempt (however stupidly) to try the user capture they did when they supported then didn't XMPP.

     But maybe I'm just paranoid.

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     &Olga (andolga@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 12:39:38 JST &Olga

     in reply to

     @Gargron Hey long as these buttons are here I'm not gonna complain

   • Embed this notice
     Kingsley Uyi Idehen (kidehen@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 13:03:24 JST Kingsley Uyi Idehen

     in reply to

     @Gargron,

     Historically, the most ardent wall-garden builders (or siloists) evolve into open standards champions, once their monopolies implode—since there’s no other path to survival.

     Open Standards always win out, eventually—and this reality is about to reshape the #SocialMedia too!

     #ActivityPub is doing its thing ?

   • Embed this notice
     realtimo@mastodon.social's status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 15:20:28 JST realTimo

     in reply to

     @Gargron Think of what the big corps did to other decentralized networks. Jabber/XMPP was adaopted, used to be interoperable, then locked back down again. Email? Try running your own infrastructure and not end up in some big corp spam filter blocklist.

     I'm not saying it's a bad move per se. I'm just not sure if it's beneficial in the long run.

   • Embed this notice
     JoergJans (joergjans@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 16:42:23 JST JoergJans

     in reply to

     @Gargron My fear is that they just see that platform as another way to gather data like „who communicates with whom“.
     There‘s a good reason I avoid everything that‘ connected with Meta.

   • Embed this notice
     acb (acb@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 18:28:40 JST acb

     in reply to

     @Gargron that sounds a bit too much like “If Microsoft is really working on a web browser”

   • Embed this notice
     John Samuel (jsamwrites@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 18:44:03 JST John Samuel

     in reply to

     @Gargron It's clear that more and more users want to free their data from one single service provider and move to services where they can import and export their data. This news from Meta about using ActivityPub/Mastodon is a great sign for future interoperable services.

   • Embed this notice
     Chris Trottier (atomicpoet@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 11-Mar-2023 20:49:18 JST Chris Trottier

     in reply to

     @Gargron All of Facebook's recent successes aren't a result of innovation. Any recent success they have is because they either acquired or copied the competition.

     Meta can't acquire the Fediverse. Therefore they copy.

     But now they're on our terrain, and the game has changed. They don't get to set the rules anymore ?

   • Embed this notice
     Mike McCue (mike@flipboard.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:02 JST Mike McCue

     in reply to

     @Gargron From experience I can tell you the Facebook playbook:

     1) Tightly embrace and clone the latest new thing

     2) Reach out to the people who've been key in building/supporting that new thing with attractive partnerships to gain their support, trust and endorsement

     3) Abruptly pull support from those same people when either a) the current new thing is under their control or b) the next new thing arrives

     I've seen these movies too many times and the sequels keep getting worse.

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Mike McCue (mike@flipboard.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:05 JST Mike McCue

     in reply to

     @Gargron I agree that this is overall a good thing for ActivityPub and for the widespread adoption of the vision you have championed. Facebook is validating the work you and others in this community have done. As Oscar Wilde said: "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness."

     That said, I can assure you that Facebook has zero intention of supporting interoperable anything, ever and will work from within to destroy anything like that from ever happening.

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     clacke (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:06 JST clacke

     in reply to

     • Mike McCue
     @mike @Gargron See e.g. Facebook and XMPP for a concrete example.
   • Embed this notice
     clacke (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:08 JST clacke

     in reply to

     • Earthling
     > Eugen Rochko's creation, the Fediverse
     The thing Eugen Rochko greatly helped popularize, for which we are forever grateful, the Fediverse.
     
     The network existed in 2008, the term in 2012–2013.
     
     @Raven47
   • Embed this notice
     Earthling (raven47@mastodon.world)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:09 JST Earthling

     in reply to

     @Gargron

     Eugen Rochko's creation, the Fediverse, is revolutionary not only for the social media landscape, but also serves as a model of decentralized, cooperative activities of many participants for other areas of society. It transforms capitalist economics and therefore cannot be combined or reconciled with approaches by monopolistic, profit-maximizing companies like Meta, Google, etc.
     Eugen, success forces caution!
     
     See also:

     https://www.ecogood.org/

     https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_for_the_Common_Good

     ? ?

   • Embed this notice
     Johannes Ernst (j12t@social.coop)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:11 JST Johannes Ernst

     in reply to

     @Gargron it won’t be ActivityPub-powered. It might speak ActivityPub — which is very different. Because it will speak it a little bit. With strange incompatibilities and glitches. And weird extensions. Sending you on wild bug chases and distracting you. Exporting only the boring stuff (e.g. to see videos you have to be logged into their app.) While they build features you can’t easily match because they have 100 people on the team.

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     rimu (rimu@venera.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:19 JST rimu

     in reply to
     @Gargron They will be defederated for failing to respond to moderation reports.
     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     :umu: :umu: (a1ba@suya.place)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:21 JST :umu: :umu:

     in reply to

     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     @lanodan @Gargron
     
     I want to believe that, but so far, it sounds like EEE. When they will have enough of AP and federation quirks, they will just silently kill it, killing social connections as well.
     
     Also Facebook is ultra censored, I don't think they just fit here.
     clacke likes this.
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     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:23 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

     • :umu: :umu:
     @a1ba @Gargron IIRC what Google did is make people migrate en masse to Google Talk, for various reasons but a lot of them even made technical sense due to XMPP's pretty poor interoperability on almost all levels and the particular case of VoIP being an horrible pain to get working thanks to NAT.
     
     Meanwhile in this particular case:
     - I don't believe people will move to Facebook's servers
     - Facebook has been leaking users for the past years, so I believe people *will* leave Facebook, specially if they can still contact some people after migrating to the other side
     - The fediverse bootstrapped itself / works standalone, it's not the extraneous network like it was in GnuSocial era where basically everyone had accounts on a bigger network
     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     :umu: :umu: (a1ba@suya.place)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:24 JST :umu: :umu:

     in reply to

     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     @lanodan @Gargron remember when Google supported XMPP? It did change the reputation of XMPP from positive to negative, when they were slowly killing XMPP support.
     
     And it wasn't a technical problem that Google's support for it was incomplete, they just didn't care enough.
     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:28 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to
     @Gargron Yeah, I do have a bit of worry in terms of culture and good old Embrace Extend Extinguish (not a strong one though, I don't think people would leave OG Fediverse to Meta, more like the other way around really).
     
     At least I would very much welcome tearing the wall of Facebook down.
   • Embed this notice
     primalmotion@antisocial.ly's status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:33 JST primalmotion

     in reply to

     @Gargron I wouldn't be so sure. It's Meta. it's cancer. Even if they start using AP, they will eventualy turn it into closed proprietary shit to shove ads into their users brain.

     Very similar to what happened with XMPP and FB Messenger, WhatsApp, Google Chat and what not

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Chris Trottier (atomicpoet@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:36 JST Chris Trottier

     in reply to

     • Ivory by Tapbots :emoji_wink:
     • Fediverse News
     • Brennan Stehling

     @brennansv Friendica has actually been around since 2010. Because it too uses ActivityPub, it’s largely cross compatible with Mastodon. This is why people on Mastodon can contribute to @fediversenews, which is a group hosted on a Friendica server.

     Also, Friendica also uses Mastodon’s API. Mobile developers like @ivory should support it but they choose not to.

     By the way, Android has better support for the rest of the Fediverse ?

     clacke likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Chris Trottier (atomicpoet@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:37 JST Chris Trottier

     in reply to

     • Brennan Stehling

     @brennansv @Gargron You can do this with Friendica right now.

   • Embed this notice
     Brennan Stehling (brennansv@sfba.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:37 JST Brennan Stehling

     in reply to

     • Chris Trottier
     • Ivory by Tapbots :emoji_wink:
     • IceCubesApp

     @atomicpoet Perhaps. I just had a look and it does not seem to be as far along as Mastodon which now has many apps. I use @ivory and @IceCubesApp which are quite good in terms of usability and visual design. I may be an early adopter but it will be hard to convince others to get onboard.

   • Embed this notice
     Brennan Stehling (brennansv@sfba.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 00:27:38 JST Brennan Stehling

     in reply to

     • Chris Trottier

     @atomicpoet @Gargron The Fediverse can copy FB groups, events and shared photo albums. It would allow so many people to finally to get off the platform.

   • Embed this notice
     Tucker Teague (tuckerteague@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 01:24:52 JST Tucker Teague

     in reply to

     @Gargron
     Corporate greed is incessant. Meta has zero interest in ActivityPub except how it might help drive up their stock price.

     My gut says to the degree that the nature of ActivityPub will not allow Meta (and other rich capitalist companies) to do what they want, they will then try to control it and change its very nature at some point and in some way we likely, today, think cannot be done and therefore will only learn about when it's too late.

   • Embed this notice
     Francois Heinderyckx (fheinderyckx@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 01:28:08 JST Francois Heinderyckx

     in reply to

     @Gargron
     For once, they can't buy it, so they at least want to be part of it. I can't dismiss the fear that they'll somehow manage to poison the well.

   • Embed this notice
     markus s (msgbi@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 01:40:14 JST markus s

     in reply to

     • charles ex

     @Gargron @charles_ex

   • Embed this notice
     mercegamell (mercegamell@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 04:23:05 JST mercegamell

     in reply to

     @Gargron I can't help thinking they have a hidden agenda.

   • Embed this notice
     Afif R. (afif@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 12-Mar-2023 18:43:05 JST Afif R.

     in reply to

     @Gargron what are your feelings towards Meta?

   • Embed this notice
     j@mastodon (jcast@mastodon.social)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 05:10:03 JST j@mastodon

     in reply to

     @Gargron

     #fediblock

   • Embed this notice
     Hahahagida (hahahagida@mastodon.social)'s status on Tuesday, 14-Mar-2023 02:24:51 JST Hahahagida

     in reply to

     @Gargron I have been here for a month now, had this page on Hatebook/Metahate for 8-9 years, my personal account for 16 years or so ... sick of FB/Meta by now. That is why I am here ?

   • Embed this notice
     Hisham (hisham_hm@mastodon.social)'s status on Tuesday, 14-Mar-2023 04:39:53 JST Hisham

     in reply to

     @Gargron just don't ever forget what happened to XMPP and the dreaded three words: embrace, extend, extinguish

   • Embed this notice
     MEActNOW (meactnow@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 16-Mar-2023 06:07:54 JST MEActNOW

     in reply to

     @Gargron I've been using www.spoutible.com ? and am loving it. It's a much easier transition from Twitter, especially for those with #Mecfs and #LongCovid #BrainFog - it's been in beta since February 1st and is rolling!
     I hope people don't go to another VC FUNDED PLATFORM like Meta. I won't join a Zuckerberg alternative for twitter.