@h4890 @amerika @korsier @Cosmic @cjd @FourOh-LLC @verita84

The main difference of opinion between capitalists and socialists is essentially negative vs positive rights respectively. The right to dissent is the underpinning of all individual rights (ie. Take "No." for an answer in respect to others' person and lawfully owned property). The moment one tries to conceive of a right to have their "needs" satisfied by others, it starts to impinge on the former, because it requires the collective to seize the property of the individual involuntarily (eg. taxation), and apply force against their person if they resist.

On the other hand, there's a lot of circumstances where without reasonable limitations on the right to accumulate exclusive property, you could end up with the bulk of society being effectively enslaved to a minority who have monopolised the available property (aka: the 1%). That's basically the crux of the turmoil between the two. Until we figure out a way of sustainably harmonising those two conflicting concerns, the problems will continue.

The other thing is that concepts like democracy need to be limited such that no collective majority decision can undermine or abrogate the individual's negative rights, otherwise it's just gang rape by another name.