Taylor Lorenz
With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
Ryan Castellucci (they/them) :nonbinary_flag:
@Viss @taylorlorenz I can't recall ever getting hoa shamed on mastodon, tbh.
But the decision paralysis is real.
Viss
@taylorlorenz the big two seen to be the decision paralysis surrounding choosing a server, and the mastodon hoa shaming new users for stuff
Rich Felker
@bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes "Often, they don't mind, or even enjoy, well done ads that fit with the flow of what they are doing."
LMAO no. Lies folks dependent on advertising tell themselves. Sigh.
bovaz
Phosphenes
The young people I know are mostly about phones, multimedia and each other. Less typing, more video, and easy sharing. So TikTok was a good fit.
But when it comes to data privacy and censorship, they are unconcerned lambs to the slaughter. Fedi's #1 selling point is lost on most of them (and US adults too, to be fair).
myrmepropagandist
I think "no ads" is a much more popular selling point than "privacy"
I mean ... even for me, it's the quality of the content and people (the fact that it's lively here) that matters most, after that? It's that there are "no ads"
The privacy is nice, but I don't think many people care about this much, or as much as we should.
myrmepropagandist
The fedi is slowly becoming a NORC (naturally occurring retirement community)
Only facebook has an older userbase.
And being more old than young that isn't a personal problem. But I wish there was more interest in making it a place younger people would care about. And that would mean listening to them.
Phosphenes
Yep I'd like my own private bird dog algorithm to sniff out feeds that match my tastes. It could even run on my own desktop computer and not bother anyone else. Trading them like baseball cards does sound fun.
Regarding OP question about why Mastodon is still small:
1. Obvious network effects. Nobody's there so nobody's there. This will slowly improve. (But the people who *are* here are really interesting!)
2. Not a business so no marketing.
myrmepropagandist
I think most people here find that kind of tracking and filtering a little creepy? But, it was also very convenient.
Over here we are like "follow two-dozen hash tags, and 300 people and then MAYBE your feed will be kind of interesting." Alternately? Here is the fire hose of your server's feed with 200 posts from the same person. Or the global feed which is just chaos.
Can we respect the art and craft of curating content? Can we make it a human thing?
myrmepropagandist
Curating content is real work. Tiktok didn't talk about it a lot but they put a great deal of effort into making the first experience users had with the app fun.
Showing them things they'd never seen before that were funny, or exciting ... using the spy data to tailor it to the particular user. Using the way the user scrolled to improve that experience.
myrmepropagandist
I would love it if there were a feed with more funny posts. You know like dril tweet type content.
I'm very happy about the complex issues and deep discussions but sometimes I'd just like to see some nonsense.
bovaz
myrmepropagandist
What if we had a kind of mini-app where users could create their own algorithms and then share combine and trade them?
I might design a mix of hashtags, users, and hand picked posts and call it "Ant News" someone else might pick a group of users and hash tags and create "Italian Football Bloopers"
Then we could share and rate these feeds and new users could just click on the popular ones?
myrmepropagandist
I think the way we make DIY discovery eg build your own algorithm so mandatory makes it hard for the fedi to fulfill the role of social media in many people's lives: a way to relax ... social media functions a lot like how people have watched TV for decades. "just to see what's on"
I think there is nothing wrong with algorithms as long as they are transparent, and created by users.
Aurochs
@taylorlorenz It lacks an addictive algorithm.
Rich Felker
@Phosphenes @futurebird @bovaz @aurochs This is a "clueless olds look down on youngs" take. If anything it's the other way around. Being "about phones, multimedia, and each other" doesn't imply you're a fool about privacy and safety.
Rich Felker
@bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes Moreover, "ads that fit with the flow" do much greater harm.
When an annoying ad interrupts what you're doing, it makes you angrily at whoever placed it, not favorable towards what they want you to desire or think.
When an ad is slipped in between Facebook posts disguised as something a friend shared, it's more likely to manipulate you.
That's a big part of why we have such a nazi problem.
Rich Felker
@log @bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes My definition of advertising is paid speech: one party pays or otherwise compensates another to say or relay a message they otherwise wouldn't have, usually to people who didn't want to hear it.
Telling your own audience who chose to be your audience about things they can buy from you isn't advertising. Nor is sharing something you like that you're not getting paid to share, to help someone whose work you like.
Log 🪵
@dalias @bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes The only ads I actually don't mind are people advertising buying options for their own work, with a direct-patronage option that cuts out most intermediators. It's the advertising by people hired for the purpose, to sell someone else's work, where it all tends to go wrong. They are involved, but not *invested* in the work. They cultivate *sales* and not *fans* [with a modicum of disposable funds].
Tim Chambers
@taylorlorenz Taylor I wrote up my thoughts here and am working on an update to document the progress made on each: https://indieweb.social/@tchambers/114739709799083596
Ryan Castellucci (they/them) :nonbinary_flag:
@Viss @taylorlorenz ah, yeah, the no alt text complaints are common. I just decided to add alt text or not post.
Viss
@taylorlorenz @ryanc ive been shamed a bunch. for not adding alt text to memes
Bruno Nicoletti
@taylorlorenz There is also the problem of retaining people. @davidallengreen, a UK lawyer with solid takes on pretty much everything, just went on an extended fedi break because the purity police didn’t like him using substack and he got bored of the hassling. Lovely own goal reply guys, the only behaviour you changed was his posting on the fedi. This is a people issue not a tech issue, which I’m not quite sure how to get around. He’s not the only one either.
GNU social JP is a social network, courtesy of GNU social JP管理人. It runs on GNU social, version 2.0.2-dev, available under the GNU Affero General Public License.
All GNU social JP content and data are available under the Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 license.