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   pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Thursday, 10-Apr-2025 21:50:40 JST pistolero

   • jae
   @jae https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Palm_Top_PC_110
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Thursday, 10-Apr-2025 21:53:10 JST you should buy a fumo

     in reply to

     • jae
     @p @jae I want
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Thursday, 10-Apr-2025 21:55:55 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @TeaTootler @jae Baby Thinkpad.
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     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:08 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler https://github.com/tulir/gomuks Looks alive to me
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:09 JST jae

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @p @TeaTootler looks like cli becomes deprecated maybe
     image.png
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:11 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org
     I might be behind the game here, but…
     FFS, real? 😲
     Sad indeed! Well TUI gomuks still works for chats — in fact, it works better than iamb, a similar TUI Matrix thing in Rust.
     
     @p@fsebugoutzone.org @TeaTootler@poa.st
     
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:12 JST jae

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @p @TeaTootler didn't gomuks change to gomuks-web or something? telling if tui -> web-ui.
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:13 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org
     I'm not going beyond 1.20 with Go, but 1.20 builds gomuks just fine — and it runs even on my Pentium-M ThinkPads. Not certain about 486 though, gc could never target anything older than i686 to my knowledge, gcc-go would have trouble building it, besides, libgo probably won't work anyway…
     
     Yeah, you're right, the plan's moot 😥
     
     @p@fsebugoutzone.org @TeaTootler@poa.st
     
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:14 JST jae

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @p @TeaTootler will gomuks compile on 32bit architecture? i don't know since i only use amd64 arch atm.
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:16 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org
     I'm not giving up on it yet, Wiki-wikipedia claims 486 is still supported…
     VESA framebuffer for the win! We can still load colour emoji font and use gomuks, profanity, amfora, w3m, chawan, tut, cmus… on this wonderful machine! 🤩
     
     BTW
     "To add to its multimedia capabilities, IBM commissioned Canon to manufacture an optional webcam that connects to the PC 110 via the PC Card slot"
     A webcam, can you imagine that? Processing any kind of video today on such a CPU is unconceivable. I remember using my ThinkPad T40 for Skype calls — it didn't have a webcam, but the one on the other end might, and it all worked beautifully. Nowadays it would probably shit its pants just attempting to load any WebRTC-cabable application 😩
     
     @p@fsebugoutzone.org @TeaTootler@poa.st
     
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:18 JST jae

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @p @TeaTootler
     
     > I wonder if it's still possible to run modern Le noops on such a machine — without X or Wayland bullshit of course 🤔
     
     you may have answered this already.
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 00:55:19 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @p@fsebugoutzone.org @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @TeaTootler@poa.st
     Intel 80486SX at 33 MHz
     4–20 MB
     I wonder if it's still possible to run modern Le noops on such a machine — without X or Wayland bullshit of course 🤔
     
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   • Embed this notice
     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:20:27 JST you should buy a fumo

     in reply to

     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @p @jae Debian is the only big distro with x86 32 bit support left
     
     I wish it was possible to get new batteries for 90s thinkpads mine would be a lot more useful if it was portable
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:40:02 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @jae @TeaTootler I ran X on a 486SX just fine. I think you'd need to use swap if you wanted to get much done on it. I don't know of many distros that fit in 260MB, though; might need to get a larger CF card. If I ask DistroWatch for active distros with a 386/486 option, it suggests Damn Small Linux, Tiny Core, and SliTaz, but SliTaz says it's "designed to run speedily on hardware with 256 MB of RAM". For something that small, you would probably be better off rolling your own. I tried to boot hal91 (`qemu-system-i386 -m 4 -vga std -enable-kvm -fda images/hal91-0.4.5.img`) and the first thing it does is try to create a few 4MB ramdisks, which it fails to do. It gives you a shell if you toss it 20MB of RAM instead of 4, though. But that's Linux 2.0.39.
     
     You'd probably get more mileage out of it if you put Plan 9 or Inferno onto it. Inferno specifically can work okay with 2MB of RAM, even $current_year Inferno (last time I checked), and although it's Unix-*like* rather than Unix, you've got a shell and a compiler and sed and grep and network utilities and whatnot. (I do not know how well the JIT works without hard-float but I also think 4MB might not be enough memory to make use of the JIT. :dracula:)
     
     There's also always "Just put FreeDOS on it" and a lot of weird OSs use DOS as a bootloader. colorFORTH environments, etc.
     hal91-0.4.5.img
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:40:31 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @TeaTootler @m0xEE @jae
     
     > Debian is the only big distro with x86 32 bit support left
     
     Slackware.
   • Embed this notice
     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:49:57 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @TeaTootler@poa.st
     Void supports 32-bit Intel albeit i686, building the base system for i386 probably won't be a problem, I still wonder how Linux kernel of today alone would fare on just 20 megabytes — no one's targeting such systems anymore, even embedded devices and routers have more RAM than that 😅
     Also, AFAIR 486 SX can only address 16-bit address space so that is likely to be a problem too.
     Or was it the case with 386 SX and DX? 🤔
     
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @p@fsebugoutzone.org
     
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:51:00 JST you should buy a fumo

     in reply to

     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @jae @p SX usually meant it had no math coprocessor iirc
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:51:13 JST jae

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • m0xEE
     @TeaTootler @m0xEE @p
     
     > no math coprocessor
     
     yes. dx models have on-pcb math-coproc. sx can't do float
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 13:51:19 JST jae

     in reply to
     @p i don't get out of bed for less than 16 threads these days. maybe in 1995 my expectations were less
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:00:24 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @TeaTootler@poa.st
     You're right about 486 and FPU!
     In case with 386 it meant 16-bit data bus though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I386#80386SX
     "The 16-bit bus simplified designs but hampered performance. Only 24 pins were connected to the address bus, therefore limiting addressing to 16 MB"
     
     I do remember there being a caveat to it — their naming is fscked up, never without a surprise! 🤪
     
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @p@fsebugoutzone.org
     
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:02:44 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @jae @TeaTootler
     
     > I'm not going beyond 1.20 with Go,
     
     Please elaborate.
   • Embed this notice
     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:03:37 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     • jae
     @dcc@annihilation.social
     Yeah, but check out the commit log — all recent changes are web-related.
     
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @p@fsebugoutzone.org @TeaTootler@poa.st
     
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:03:43 JST jae

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     • m0xEE
     @dcc @TeaTootler @m0xEE @p
     
     informational infographic
     image.png
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:12:36 JST you should buy a fumo

     in reply to

     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @jae @p In the 90s the connectix quickcam used serial on Macs (fuck) and parallel port on PCs (did you enable ECP anon?)
     
     Looked like shit on apples
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:13:36 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @TeaTootler@poa.st @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @p@fsebugoutzone.org
     ECP
     Our (still perfectly capable) here gadget might not even support such newfangled things 👴
     
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:13:43 JST you should buy a fumo

     in reply to

     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @jae @p 1995 so it’s EPP if you’re lucky
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     zero escape (zero@nightshift.social)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:23:00 JST zero escape

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     Debian is one of the few distros with 32 bit PowerPC support as well...
     
     An old G4 macintosh with 1GB ram still VERY usable unless you want to watch youtube.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:25:45 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • zero escape
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @zero @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE Oh, yeah, I mean, use my RISC-V DevTerm a lot: single-core, 1GHz, 1GB RAM. I rolled a Slackware image for it. Except that the only browsers I have installed are w3m and netsurf, everything else that I do works just fine. I figure even with Debian, I could get by all right on an old G4.
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     anime graf mays ?️? (graf@poa.st)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:25:51 JST anime graf mays ?️?

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @p @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE TeaTootler where the hardware needed Y2K patching and the girls are Alpha
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:26:30 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • anime graf mays ?️?
     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @graf @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE I ain't need the machine to know what day it is, I don't know what day it is.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:28:47 JST RedTechEngineer

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @p @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler
     void
     gentoo
     linux mint
     Parabola
     Hyperbola (for now. They plan to deprecate Linux in favor of the OpenBSD kernel)
     Guix
     
     
     Actually every distro I could think of off the top of my head has 32bit except Arch, Ubuntu, and Fedora.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:29:28 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE If you can get Mint or Gentoo to run on a machine with 4MB of RAM and 260MB of storage, I need your notes.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:29:34 JST RedTechEngineer

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @p @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE and for Arch fans theres https://archlinux32.org/
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     zero escape (zero@nightshift.social)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:33:13 JST zero escape

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     urge to buy ATX format Risc V board rising.
     
     I want RISC V to be competitive with ARM.
     
     keep hardware open or else you end up with shit like intel management engine or AMD's version psp.. platform whatever I dont remember
     
     we dont need secret computers running inside the main computer.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:33:18 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • zero escape
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @zero @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler
     
     > I want RISC V to be competitive with ARM.
     
     I think, give it maybe ten years, there'll be more RISC-V than ARM on the low end and it'll be creeping up to the middle, maybe some of the high end. It's got the same characteristics that made x86 eat the world.
     
     > we dont need secret computers running inside the main computer.
     
     Seconded.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:33:24 JST RedTechEngineer

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @p @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler I'm sure it's possible for someone much smarter than I am with plenty of free time
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:33:40 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE I don't think it can be done but I am always ready to be surprised.
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     Phantasm (phnt@fluffytail.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:36:00 JST Phantasm

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler 4MB of RAM is probably doable with a kernel config, but 260MB of storage is much harder since the stage3 tarball is only a little bit smaller than that. And the limiting factor is probably python.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:46:21 JST RedTechEngineer

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @phnt @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler maybe cheating. But you could sidestep the storage issue by temporarily mounting a network volume.
     If you need more memory just mount a Google drive volume or floppy disk for SWAP :D
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:46:54 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @phnt @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE
     
     > And the limiting factor is probably python.
     
     I had a little iPAQ and when Compaq ported Linux to it, I went for it. One of the things I wanted to do was be able to write programs, and there was just 32MB of storage, so gcc didn't fit, Perl didn't fit. I had an assembler, and there were packages for two other languages that fit in a couple of megs: Python and Ruby. I read a little of the Pickaxe Book and I was basically horrified by the typical OO "dog is a kind of animal" tutorial shit in it so I looked at a Python tutorial and saw the syntactically significant whitespace and that is how I learned Ruby.
     
     (Using vi with gestures was a real adventure.)
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     zero escape (zero@nightshift.social)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:47:00 JST zero escape

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     when i see the first raspberry pi running risc v. the binaries will follow.
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     Phantasm (phnt@fluffytail.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:49:16 JST Phantasm

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler As networking you have a modem. No fancy pcmcia since the HDD uses that. Also floppy not included.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:52:45 JST RedTechEngineer

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @phnt @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler use btrfs with the strongest FS compression 🦧
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:55:54 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • zero escape
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @zero @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler
     
     > when i see the first raspberry pi running risc v.
     
     RPi is UK, ARM is UK, I don't think they're going to switch out any time soon.
     
     But besides the RPi form-factor that is super popular nowadays, there is a 64-core RISC-V workstation, ( https://www.crowdsupply.com/milk-v/milk-v-pioneer ), there are RISC-V clusterboards ( https://www.cnx-software.com/2023/09/19/lichee-cluster-4a-mini-itx-risc-v-cluster-board/ ), you can make a babby supercomputer for $2 in parts ( https://hackaday.com/2023/04/19/risc-v-supercluster-for-very-low-cost/ ), there's a chip that's pin-compatible with the RPi CM-4 ( https://milkv.io/mars-cm ) and people are slotting it into the TuringPi already ( https://feldspaten.org/2023/10/27/RISC-V-in-a-Turing-Pi-2/ ).
     
     I think, though, give it ten years. I love ARM, but since ARMs are all made by licensing, ARM's main strength in the marketplace is holding its IP. But now here's an ISA that is also low-power RISC without any IP encumbrance and with plenty of manufacturers, it runs Linux, it does embedded systems, etc.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:57:26 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @phnt @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE
     
     > mounting a network volume.
     
     You could maybe get a 10mbit ethernet PCI card, but the only built-in network connectivity is a pop-out modem. You'd probably do the build off-device.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 14:58:16 JST pistolero

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @phnt @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE
     
     > use btrfs with the strongest FS compression
     
     I didn't even do FS encryption until I got a dual-core CPU. Compression on a 33MHz single-core chip is going to be painful.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:00:56 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • waff
     • m0xEE
     @waff @phnt @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE Or just...not Linux. I know this idea shocks a lot of people but if you are on specialized hardware where regular Linux isn't going to work anyway and you've got to use a heavily modified system, you might have an easier time using something that isn't Linux. $current_year glibc doesn't work on old-timey 2.x Linux.
     
     That having been said, there are semi-maintained forks already. I don't know where to find them because I wouldn't buy an ancient machine just to run $current_year Linux slop on it.
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     waff (waff@eientei.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:00:57 JST waff

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • RedTechEngineer
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @phnt @RedTechEngineer @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler this is why we need more forks of legacy linux kernels, ones that have no rust, ones that are 2.x with patches, etc. Itd immensely help compatibility and size restrictions
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      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:02:55 JST 

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     @p @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler DriveSpace has been around since MS-DOS 6.0.
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      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:03:28 JST 

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     @p @waff @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler https://github.com/ghaerr/elks
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:04:10 JST pistolero

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     @mint @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE @phnt Available versus usable.
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     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:06:15 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

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     • m0xEE
     @p @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE Heh meanwhile these days it's perl eating ~36MB, python eating ~22MB, ruby eating ~16MB.
     And lua eating just ~420KB.
     (Using Alpine x86_64 packages for the sizes, without forgetting libruby and liblua)
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     Phantasm (phnt@fluffytail.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:08:45 JST Phantasm

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     @p @waff @RedTechEngineer @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler When NetBSD says you need to make your own kernel configuration to even try running it, you know you are probably in deep trouble with modern systems.
     Screenshot_2025-04-11-08-06-47-79_5dca195d7d09adf043e42a8f3ad62b19.jpg
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:09:27 JST pistolero

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     @mint @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE @phnt @waff Boots insanely fast in qemu:
     fd1200-fat.img
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     ?? Humpleupagus ?? (humpleupagus@eveningzoo.club)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:12:03 JST ?? Humpleupagus ??

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     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVqN_FixG0M
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:12:07 JST pistolero

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     @mint @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE @phnt @waff
     fuckit.png
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     waff (waff@eientei.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:12:13 JST waff

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     @p @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler gcc just werks
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:12:24 JST pistolero

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     @waff @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE @phnt glibc doesn't.
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      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:14:49 JST 

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     @p @waff @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler I don't think it'll be too hard to build, though I think the floppy image lacks compilers.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:15:23 JST pistolero

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     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
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     @lanodan @RedTechEngineer @jae @m0xEE @phnt Some day, this will all be under water.
     
     For the sake of my career, I'm glad I learned Ruby, though I think on a device that size, I'd be happier with Lua or Forth.
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     waff (waff@eientei.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:16:14 JST waff

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     @p @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler @mint if only there was more 68k legacy support.
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     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:19:25 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

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     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     • RedTechEngineer
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     @p @RedTechEngineer @jae @m0xEE @phnt Ooh tcl is ~4.1MB, still seems pretty big (busybox is ~800KB, and even bash is 1.3MB) but compared to perl/python/ruby it's pretty good.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:23:19 JST pistolero

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     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
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     @lanodan @RedTechEngineer @jae @m0xEE @phnt If I do `pkginfo -l tcl`, it includes a lot of headers, sqlite3 library, some internationalization stuff, a massive number of man pages, etc. I imagine that the ipk file for it wouldn't include most of that stuff.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:23:25 JST RedTechEngineer

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     @phnt @waff @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler
     
     
     Minix 2 should work
     
     Alternatively
     
     http://www.menuetos.net/download.htm
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:23:44 JST RedTechEngineer

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     @phnt @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE @p @waff
     
     Freedos should run pretty comfortably as well
     
     https://freedos.org/download/
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     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:35:11 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

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     @p @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE Yeah, although tcl-dev is just 800KB and tcl-doc is 1.2MB

     And interestingly Alpine throws away pkg/sqlite3* from tcl source, with tcl's ./configure ignoring --with-system-sqlite so that's… kind of weird.

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:46:56 JST pistolero

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     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
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     @lanodan @RedTechEngineer @jae @m0xEE @phnt That's weird, yeah. Tcl is one of those languages where you can do a lot of application programming or glue code and get, like, 90% of what anyone wants at 90% of the speed in less than 1% of the space (and probably less than 10% of the effort), same as sqlite3. I think TinyCore uses Tcl/Tk for a lot of its GUI (or used to).
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     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:51:41 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

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     @p @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE Yeah what I know tcl for is the expect testsuite tool and pretty light but powerful Tcl/Tk applications.

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 15:52:36 JST pistolero

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     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     • RedTechEngineer
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     @lanodan @RedTechEngineer @jae @m0xEE @phnt Also:
     
     :mycomputer: less $(which gitk)
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 17:14:43 JST m0xEE

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • jae
     @p@fsebugoutzone.org
     I've just given up on Go at this point — not only the implementation, but the language itself keeps changing too fast, with Rust no one promised something stable and even Rust isn't that bad. God knows, I tried keeping up with it — 32-bit PowerPC is no longer supported, but I've built the latest version of gcc-go that works on the machine this instance is hosted on, which is Go 1.10. I've backported Bloat to it and it works fine on this machine, but beyond it — backporting is too much effort.
     And it's not about essential things, it's no longer the language that "Go Programming Language" book is about, it's something else entirely. Like "Ya-ay, let's re-do iterators" — and no, some internal unification in the standard library does not sound like a good enough justification to me. But Go community seems to like it that way, go to HNews and you'll see articles like "I redid everything with new iterators so now you can't build my module with older toolchain". WTF did you do that for, just because you could?
     And it seems a lot of people weren't keeping up, so they have added an option to add a line to go.mod that forces a particular version of toolchain which… gets downloaded from the Internet — just like that. No, Google, it's not supposed to work like that, so fuck you! Just fuck you!
     In a lot of environments you can't do things like that and I can't do it like that because you have dropped support for the machines I want to run my tiny piece of software on. I'm not a corporate samurai, who builds only for the latest Intel and 64-bit ARM, hoping that it might also work on something else. So I'm out!
     
     Go 1.20 might seem chosen almost arbitrarily, but it can build all the software in Go that I still use. I'm not relying on any other software in Go and not using it for my personal needs because it's cancer — Google has killed it for me.
     
     @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @TeaTootler@poa.st
     
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     Phantasm (phnt@fluffytail.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 17:23:05 JST Phantasm

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     @m0xEE @p @jae @TeaTootler
     >But Go community seems to like it that way, go to HNews and you'll see articles like "I redid everything with new iterators so now you can't build my module with older toolchain". WTF did you do that for, just because you could?
     Gitea in a nutshell. Unbuildable piece of software unless you are using latest-2 and sometimes not even that.
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     Phantasm (phnt@fluffytail.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 17:24:46 JST Phantasm

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     • Phantasm
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     @m0xEE @TeaTootler @jae @p I thought that Forgejo would at least stop doing that. Which they did with their LTS versions, but they also didn't fix annoying bugs in them, so it became nearly unusable.
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     laurel (laurel@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 19:33:09 JST laurel

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     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @p @jae @TeaTootler
     
     >A few packages in the standard library provide iterator-based APIs
     The standard library is about APIs now.
     Even the presentation regarding iterators is horrible, with the new [yield] keyword/function type (which is a Python name btw) being buried mid article with minimal explanation.
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 19:54:38 JST jae

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     • m0xEE
     @phnt @TeaTootler @m0xEE @p they're also shoving mcp into the system now for all the .ai worshippers. gitea has really went commercial. forgejo isn't much better but im not sure what you mean its nearly unusable. ive got forgejo running fine for about a year. ci/cd is nearly always building and deploying for our our group.
     
     we tend to work on latest go so version bump and new patterns aren't big problems.
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 19:57:04 JST jae

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     • laurel
     • m0xEE
     @laurel @m0xEE @TeaTootler @p python set the course for yield. we use it in ruby too.
     Husky_1744368955603_UEY4Z4OXJ9.jpg
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 19:58:25 JST pistolero

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     @jae @laurel @TeaTootler @m0xEE Pretty sure Ruby's yield predates Python's and came from Smalltalk (or I remember it being in Perl, I think), but I also think it's a little out of place in Go.
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:02:57 JST jae

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     • laurel
     • m0xEE
     @p @TeaTootler @laurel @m0xEE i couldn't remember when it was introduced. it was really handwavy thingy in python. then again ive only written .rb since ~2011 so maybe i glazed over it for years.
     
     yes it doesn't seem good in go.
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     john paul grips (grips@cawfee.club)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:19:07 JST john paul grips

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     @RedTechEngineer @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler I tried :arch:32 on a 1.6GHz Celeron netbook about a year ago and there were some packages that weren't rebuilt in months - the python toolchain? my memory is a bit hazy but I think it caused a few issues with AUR packages
     
     it worked pretty nicely though
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:23:22 JST jae

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     @p @waff @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt
     
     > because I wouldn't buy an ancient machine just to run $current_year Linux slop on it.
     
     there's a trend to going back to these ancient devices. something-something permacomputing. which i don't get.
     
     when the flood comes, it won't matter. we'll be floating on our laptops before being swallowed by basilisk
     
     i think i would not go back > 8yrs (and i havent' with the t480s)
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:25:22 JST pistolero

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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt @waff
     
     > there's a trend to going back to these ancient devices. something-something permacomputing. which i don't get.
     
     Old machines are fun; people have to turn anything into a Cause nowadays. Minimalist computing is fun, too, getting some use out of really old shit.
     
     > i think i would not go back > 8yrs (and i havent' with the t480s)
     
     Hold my beer.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:27:03 JST pistolero

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     @waff @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler Posted from M100 by means of serial terminal.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:30:13 JST pistolero

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     • m0xEE
     @waff @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler Seriously: serial terminal (19200 8n1), Linux machine, drawterm -G into the Plan 9 box, fse/bbs to get to the ssh interface, and I am posting from a 1983 computer.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:32:10 JST pistolero

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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt @waff
     
     > it's fun if you have the gear, but there's some who will pay top dollar just to claim retro/minimal/whatever-cause.
     
     Assholes drivin' up the cost of VT100s.
     
     > visions of tony robbins in an elevator
     tonyrobinson.png
   • Embed this notice
     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:32:11 JST jae

     in reply to

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     • RedTechEngineer
     • Phantasm
     • waff
     • m0xEE
     @p @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt @waff
     
     > Old machines are fun; people have to turn anything into a Cause nowadays. Minimalist computing is fun, too, getting some use out of really old shit.
     
     it's fun if you have the gear, but there's some who will pay top dollar just to claim retro/minimal/whatever-cause.
     
     the only cause i endorse is crunching machine code (and global hysteria for laughs)
     
     > Hold my beer.
     
     visions of tony robbins in an elevator
     image.png
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 20:32:31 JST jae

     in reply to

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     • waff
     • m0xEE
     @p @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt @waff
     image.png
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     Phantasm (phnt@fluffytail.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 21:15:54 JST Phantasm

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     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler
     
     >they're also shoving mcp into the system now for all the .ai worshippers
     Imagine not knowing how to use git.
     
     >forgejo isn't much better but im not sure what you mean its nearly unusable. ive got forgejo running fine for about a year. ci/cd is nearly always building and deploying for our our group.
     It's a collection of small bug fixes they didn't backport from upstream that drove me crazy.
     
     LDAP auth was broken for more than a month with a fix already in Gitea (maybe still isn't fixed). At work we depended on this, so I had to build custom images after every update.
     
     Mirrors with LFS objects would seemingly randomly balloon in size. This one annoyed me for months until it got fixed in some release.
     
     And lastly, after the addition of Forgejo actions, mirrors would start to have failing pipelines that got enabled automatically even though zero runners were configured. The solution was either manually go through 30 mirrors and disable actions manually for every repo, or completely disable actions in settings. The failing actions would be that big of a deal, if Forgejo cleaned them up properly from the DB. A fix for this with `gitea doctor` has been in upstream for 5 months and it still has not reached Forgejo v7.X which is the first affected version I think.
     
     One day, I got fed up with Forgejo thanks Chinese scrapers downloading bundles and tarballs which created 30GB of orphaned archives, compared the Forgejo v7 and Gitea 1.21 (base for Forgejo v7) schemas and manually reverted the migrations. Did the same few days later at work and that solved all our problems I had with Forgejo. Plus the whole relicensing thing with Forgejo rubbed me the wrong way. They tried LibreOffice EEE and failed. Companies still prefer Gitea or even GitLab (we use both for reasons).
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 21:53:16 JST jae

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • Phantasm
     • m0xEE
     @phnt @TeaTootler @m0xEE @p
     
     
     > Imagine not knowing how to use git.
     
     does not compute.
     
     > It's a collection of small bug fixes they didn't backport from upstream that drove me crazy.
     
     do you have a list besides what you listed here? i maintain my own fork and can bring them forward.
     
     > LDAP auth was broken for more than a month with a fix already in Gitea (maybe still isn't fixed). At work we depended on this, so I had to build custom images after every update.
     
     interesting that people use this for work. i think forgejo is a bit behind since they are volunteers and not paid coders
     
     > Mirrors with LFS objects would seemingly randomly balloon in size. This one annoyed me for months until it got fixed in some release.
     
     i saw this too, but i only mirror one repo so it wasn't a big problem.
     
     > And lastly, after the addition of Forgejo actions, mirrors would start to have failing pipelines that got enabled automatically even though zero runners were configured.
     
     it sounds like default behavior is to pull in repo attrs like actions_enabled: true is that what you mean? i disabled actions on my system since it's not very mature. i used woodpecker which is fine atm.
     
     > One day, I got fed up with Forgejo thanks Chinese scrapers downloading bundles and tarballs which created 30GB of orphaned archives, compared the Forgejo v7 and Gitea 1.21 (base for Forgejo v7) schemas and manually reverted the migrations. Did the same few days later at work and that solved all our problems I had with Forgejo. Plus the whole relicensing thing with Forgejo rubbed me the wrong way. They tried LibreOffice EEE and failed. Companies still prefer Gitea or even GitLab (we use both for reasons).
     
     i can understand how this might be an issue for work/business. my business is just get shit done and hack everything. i have the luxury of laughing at licensing.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 21:54:54 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • Phantasm
     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @jae @phnt @TeaTootler @m0xEE
     
     > i disabled actions on my system since it's not very mature.
     
     And completely changes the service from "Store these blobs" to "execute arbitrary code".
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Friday, 11-Apr-2025 22:42:34 JST jae

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     • you should buy a fumo
     • Phantasm
     • m0xEE
     @p @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt
     
     > And completely changes the service from "Store these blobs" to "execute arbitrary code".
     
     the system doesn't exec arbitrary code. it handles git operations, drops builds, runs linters, sast/sca, full test-harness with regression suite, then deployments where applicable. it's all very intentional.
     
     ace theoretically could occur in the ci system (not related to forgejo), however if the operator is running a ci system that allows elevated privilege to the host operating system that the runners kick on, that is problematic and poor choice to make. i do not have that problem.
     
     and the scraper issue people were hemming/hawing about is a non issue when you have a waf at the edge, which we do. (servo has ascended)
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 00:43:12 JST jae

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     • waff
     • m0xEE
     @waff @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @p @phnt
     
     
     > people who pay top dollar are suckers
     
     i know this too well
     
     > e waste facilities
     
     i've got a three node kubernetes cluster running on e-waste. it's nice e-waste, but e-waste nonetheless. i also gifted some to another kubernetes operator for the cost of shipping
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     waff (waff@eientei.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 00:43:14 JST waff

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     • jae
     • m0xEE
     @jae @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler people who pay top dollar are suckers when most dying machines can be easily be taken from e waste facilities, old offices being renovated, libraries, etc.
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 01:47:36 JST jae

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     @TeaTootler @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE
     
     > almost my entire network is e waste
     
     excellent. i draw the line at router/switch. those are all newer components.
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 01:47:37 JST you should buy a fumo

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE almost my entire network is e waste
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:33:21 JST pistolero

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     @waff @jae @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @phnt Yeah, but dumpster-diving is a crapshoot and no one is throwing away a VT-100.
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     waff (waff@eientei.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:33:38 JST waff

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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler ive gotten a 128gb ram sun fire from an e waste facility for 10 bucks. Agreed.
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:33:54 JST jae

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     • waff
     • m0xEE
     @waff @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @m0xEE @p @phnt good find! had a stack of sparc10s before giving them away when i moved. i refuse to buy new unless it's something that is a requirement for an important project or it's a legitimate need (only .001% of things fit that category)
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:35:05 JST you should buy a fumo

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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE my switches are e waste but the router isn’t
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:37:55 JST jae

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     • m0xEE
     @TeaTootler @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE i was on juniper poe switch but it started overheating, went with unifi so i can be cool. router is industrial grade quad core machine passive cooled running opnsense. i've had it for 5 years now and it's like a timex.
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:37:59 JST you should buy a fumo

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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE i ran pfSense on a dell dimension pentium 4 desktop with 2 3com NICs for over 4-5 years before someone took pity on me and bought a unifi router
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:38:18 JST you should buy a fumo

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     • m0xEE
     @m0xEE @RedTechEngineer @jae @p it was one of the late models so measured power draw was about 15-20 watts but i wasn't paying for the electricity
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     m0xEE (m0xee@nosh0b10.m0xee.net)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:38:19 JST m0xEE

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     @TeaTootler@poa.st
     pentium 4 desktop
     Your power bill must have been… impressive 😅
     
     @RedTechEngineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link @phnt@fluffytail.org @jae@fsebugoutzone.org @p@fsebugoutzone.org
     
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:44:05 JST jae

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     @TeaTootler @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE
     
     > took pity on me and bought a unifi router
     
     they're great if you have single-line. where i'm at we have 1xfiber 1xcopper 1xlte 1xsat connections so having 6 ports is a requirement (two for trunk to core switch)
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     you should buy a fumo (teatootler@poa.st)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:44:22 JST you should buy a fumo

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     @jae @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE it has more than one WAN interface but I only have one internet
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     jae (jae@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:44:28 JST jae

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     • m0xEE
     @TeaTootler @RedTechEngineer @phnt @p @m0xEE that one is tricky. they do failover, but doing things like selective dnat/routing is really a pain in the ass.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:50:23 JST RedTechEngineer

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     @p @waff @phnt @jae @m0xEE @TeaTootler the other day I found a whole PDP-11 in the Applebee's dumpster.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:51:09 JST pistolero

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     @RedTechEngineer @TeaTootler @jae @m0xEE @phnt @waff If it was sticky, like, just leave it for the next guy.
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     waff (waff@eientei.org)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 11:51:21 JST waff

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     • RedTechEngineer
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     • m0xEE
     @RedTechEngineer @phnt @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler pics or it didn't happen.
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     RedTechEngineer (redtechengineer@fedi.lowpassfilter.link)'s status on Saturday, 12-Apr-2025 17:59:29 JST RedTechEngineer

     in reply to

     • you should buy a fumo
     • Phantasm
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     • m0xEE
     @waff @phnt @jae @p @m0xEE @TeaTootler of course!
     
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