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   Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:16:39 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

   Only on #Mastodon do I see people judging people being on #Substack and #X, seemingly implying that they are better humans for not being on it.
   This betrays their massive privilege & ignorance of how cultures outside theirs operates on #SocialMedia.
   People fm less privileged countries rely on them to get their messages out. Self-hosted options that are priced for Americans. It is not "the price of a cup of coffee" for everyone.
   So, you are not impressing me with the virtue signalling.

   • Embed this notice
     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:19:48 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     And even if they are not from third world countries, what does it matter to you if they are on #Substack? Why must everyone conform to your values, morality and idea of what is a good platform?
     This desire to ensure a platform is "pure" is stupid because this is never gonna be achievable, unless you prefer to be a hermit and cut yourself off #SocialMedia.

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     David Chartier (chartier@toot.cafe)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:22:57 JST David Chartier

     in reply to

     @liztai Are there alternatives to Substack? Newsletters as a market seem pretty popular, and there is a lot of competition. Are those options not reachable outside the US?

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:22:57 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • David Chartier

     @chartier Even if there is why should they leave? The thing these values are not even theirs and they wont understand the need to. I don't understand the insistence. Yes there are options but are often not affordable or as effective as Substack. Americans may be spending a few hundred a year for a mail delivery service, but for these people it could be a few months of wages.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:25:10 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Joanna Holman

     @joannaholman Yea it is a very left leaning space here. Learned it the hard way 🤣 On top of that, if you are not American, don't happen to share their lefty values or views of doing things , prepared to be canceled! For eg try discussing Biden's age and see what happens! It is not really free speech here, tbh

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     Joanna Holman (joannaholman@aus.social)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:25:11 JST Joanna Holman

     in reply to

     @liztai And also Mastodon is not the haven for everyone people often act like it is. The culture here around discussion of things like religion can be weird and a bit hostile at times so I'm not surprised people who want to talk about those things have stayed on Twitter or gone to other commercial alternatives.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:32:35 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • David Chartier

     @chartier this btw is a very unique American pearl clutching thing. Believe it or not many people outside these particular ideological POV don't care a rats ass because they know if you avoid every platform with bad people there's no platform to go to.
     Also, people don't really care for a platform's values as long as it helps them do stuff?
     Does this sound callous? Well, it is true. Many people treat Substack as a tool, not a church.

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     David Chartier (chartier@toot.cafe)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:32:36 JST David Chartier

     in reply to

     @liztai From what I've seen, the primary criticism of Substack is that they refuse to deplatform their serious Nazi problem. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/11/substack-extremism-nazi-white-supremacy-newsletters/676156/

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     David Chartier (chartier@toot.cafe)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:32:36 JST David Chartier

     in reply to

     @liztai In addition, The Verge interviewed their CEO recently and asked point blank "you have writers who say things like 'black people do not belong in America.' Is that something you think should be on your platform?'"

     And they straight up would not answer the question. Dodged it as hard as possible and forced the conversation to move on.

     It's concerning.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:33:17 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • David Chartier

     @chartier PS while they complain about Nazis they ignore sinophobic content. Its pretty hypocritical tbh.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:36:16 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Ellane W

     @ellane I used to try to understand them, but now i no longer care about being polite. They caused such a ruckus on Substack when many of us are just trying to do our own thing and create quietly. They damaged a platform many of us love, and worse some people's livelihoods depend on Substack. Do i think that's a wise strategy to depend so much on Substack? No, but these virtue signallers did not care at all for others when they did their moral crusade.

   • Embed this notice
     Ellane W (ellane@pkm.social)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:36:18 JST Ellane W

     in reply to

     @liztai I get it. Seems to me that people who boycott Substack had also better not be buying clothing produced in a sweatshop, or diamonds/coffee/chocolate that isn't fair trade. The list goes on.

     Fact is, it's *hard* if not impossible to find that kind of purity!

     I also get that many people are doing what they can, and not letting the vastness of the problem stop them from doing *something*. The extreme virtue signalling isn't helping, I agree.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:42:35 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Steven D. Brewer 🏳️‍⚧️

     @stevendbrewer Too bad, really. Lots of beautiful writing there. But it is ok to have that stance as long as you are not all superior about it.

   • Embed this notice
     Steven D. Brewer 🏳️‍⚧️ (stevendbrewer@wandering.shop)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:42:36 JST Steven D. Brewer 🏳️‍⚧️

     in reply to

     @liztai My only comment is that I'm extremely unlikely to visit anything hosted on substack.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:52:28 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Mark Levison
     • Ellane W

     @mlevison Not talking about you specifically but about people who dunk others for using Substack and somehow imply those who do support Nazis. Whether one leaves or stays is 100% their right, but leaving and then writing a whole spiel about it is eye rolling. Leaving doesn't have to be a declaration of moral superiority. @ellane

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     Mark Levison (mlevison@agilealliance.social)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 07:52:29 JST Mark Levison

     in reply to

     • Ellane W

     @liztai @ellane I’m confused

     Why is it about virtue signalling?

     In my case I made a choice. I chatted with newsletter writers who are friends.

     I unsubscribed from everything that stayed on substack. My choices aren’t about anyone else.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 08:04:31 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • David Chartier

     @chartier yes yes I have heard it all. Fyi i saw this SAME moral panic about Twitter, Threads, Facebook, with the same argument. To me, it is silly to be upset about this. Because its everywhere. Even Ghost, which is largely unmoderated and is such a Substack substitute fav, will have Nazis. To me it is the hypocrisy of it all that galls.

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     David Chartier (chartier@toot.cafe)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 08:04:32 JST David Chartier

     in reply to

     @liztai And that includes hate of everyone not white and usually Christian. China, black people, Mexicans, these people are equal opportunity haters. And Substack chooses to give them all megaphones.

   • Embed this notice
     Sean Bala (seanbala@mas.to)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 09:37:57 JST Sean Bala

     in reply to

     @liztai I've been noticing a lot of virtue signaling here lately. Maybe I've been tuning it out but its coming up a lot. I came here in part because I found it to be a welcoming space.

     You might laugh but something I've been thinking about lately is the idea that for a loud subsection of people, they define themselves as heroes fighting evil forces. Many of these people think that they are the good guys and if you've got good guys, there must be bad guys to fight.

     1/2

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     Sean Bala (seanbala@mas.to)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 09:48:31 JST Sean Bala

     in reply to

     • BBC Radio 4
     • Jon Ronson

     @liztai I got this idea from the final episode of "Things Fall Apart" by @jonronson on @BBCRadio4. The series looks at the origins of contemporary culture wars in the West and is one of the best podcasts I've listened to. The second season looks at Covid conspiracies and the final episode looks at the director of "Plandemic." Ronson argues that this guy internalized Joseph Campbell's "Hero's Journey" into a totalizing worldview based on good fighting evil.

     2/3

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     Sean Bala (seanbala@mas.to)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 09:50:13 JST Sean Bala

     in reply to

     • BBC Radio 4
     • Jon Ronson

     @liztai @jonronson @BBCRadio4 Once I thought about it, I can see this idea everywhere on both left and right. For many, they WANT dragons to fight against because THEY are good and those I don't like are evil. This way of thinking appeals to a certain type of person who tends to be loud.

     3/3

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 09:54:25 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Sean Bala
     • BBC Radio 4
     • Jon Ronson

     @seanbala @jonronson @BBCRadio4 Oh thank you for recommending me the podcast! I think i listened to the first season but not the second season.
     If i told my parents whats happening on social media with the virtue signalling, mum would say: "Chiak pa siao eng". (You have eaten your fill and now you are too free.) Basically, if you dont have survival issues to deal with (hunger, war, safety), your mind becomes fat and too free so you engage in unproductive behavior to look busy. 🤣

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 09:55:38 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Sean Bala
     • BBC Radio 4
     • Jon Ronson

     @seanbala Frankly put, people in my part of the world are too worried about daily issues to care about telling people on social media about our values. Those who do are from the privileged class. @jonronson @BBCRadio4

   • Embed this notice
     Rosano / Strolling (rosano@mastodon.online)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 12:43:31 JST Rosano / Strolling

     in reply to

     • Boris Mann

     @liztai @boris purist reductions of any platform and the people there to it's worst policy is lazy; it's harder and more meaningful to actually help.

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     Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾 (liztai@hachyderm.io)'s status on Sunday, 18-Feb-2024 12:43:31 JST Elizabeth Tai | 戴秀铃 🇲🇾

     in reply to

     • Boris Mann
     • Rosano / Strolling

     @rosano @boris 100% what you said.