Evan Prodromou
Here are the top data services I'd love to see come to the fediverse next year:
- OpenLibrary. https://openlibrary.org/ . A great collection of books, movies, audio, other.
- OpenStreetMap. https://www.openstreetmap.org/ We need a good `Place` vocabulary, and OSM has a great one.
- MusicBrainz. https://musicbrainz.org/ A great way to represent `Audio` objects cross-service. The best music encyclopedia on the planet.
- Wikidata. https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Main_Page For, well, everything else.
Evan Prodromou
Here are some of the user account servers I'd love to see come to the fediverse:
- Apple ID. 1.5B users. Already used for an ID, but not a social one.
- Firefox ID. 300M? users. Mozilla is an ally that has announced future support of ActivityPub.
- Google ID. 1.8B users. Widely used, no social network yet.
- Microsoft ID. 1B? users. Used mostly for Office 365, Teams, and XBox. Possible connection through Teams.
Evan Prodromou
@bakaniko You misunderstood me.
I mean, one ActivityPub object for every way, relation and node in the OSM database.
We have an object type, Place, in ActivityPub, that represents a place. But not a lot (if at all) public objects that represent places.
bakaniko
@evan
There is @openstreetmap
And some local groups like @osm_fr
Dr. Matt Lee is at hireme.fyi
@evan anything I can do to bring Musicbrainz to the new-Librefm will happen. I’m just too miserable in general with other bullshit going on to think about anything right now.
Evan Prodromou
@mattl man, that sucks. We should do a call.
Also, I apologize for my snotty reply. I am trying to avoid saying things I don't mean online, and I don't always manage.
Evan Prodromou
@bakaniko So, basically, we just need an URL like https://activitypub.openstreetmap.example/node/299790200 that returns a Place in AS2 format, like:
```
{
"@context": "https://www.w3.org/ns/activitystreams",
"id": "https://activitypub.openstreetmap.example/node/299790200"
"type": "Place",
"nameMap": {
"en": "Montreal",
"fr": "Montréal"
},
"latitude": 45.5031824,
"longitude": -73.5698065
}
```
bakaniko
@evan
Oh. In that way. Sorry 😅
Didn't even know it is possible to do that with ActivityPub ...
Do you think you can use with something like Mobilizon to help locate an event ? Or something like that ?
Evan Prodromou
@mattl it would make a good client for ActivityPub servers. So when you scrobble something, it generates a `Listen` activity into your stream.
Dr. Matt Lee is at hireme.fyi
@evan it’s okay.
I have a few hundred million MBIDs of stuff people have listened to and that data isn’t really exposed at all right now. It would be fun to do something.
New librefm is going to be…. different. Not sure exactly how it’ll wind up looking. I’m torn. I don’t think there’s a lot of use in making a clone of a 20 year old website.
Brendan Jones
@evan What sort of use cases would you see these having? Curious what you have in mind.
Evan Prodromou
@Brendanjones OSM for geo-social applications: `Arrive`, `Leave`, `Travel` activities, plus the `location` element of other activities or content objects.
MB and OL for media experience activities like `Listen`, `View`, `Read`. So, `Evan read Doppelganger` or `Evan listened to A Little Respect by Erasure`.
Wikidata for these and, like, a million other uses.
Evan Prodromou
@cquest @bakaniko @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber
For ActivityPub, we have a `location` attribute for every activity type and for content objects. So, "This photo was taken in Antwerp" could be encoded with:
```
{
"type": "Image",
"location": https://activitypub.openstreetmap.example/node/1765433658
}
```
FB, Twitter have their own gazetteers for this, but on the fediverse it would be cool to use OSM.
Christian Quest 🌍
@bakaniko @evan @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber what use case do you imagine ?
bakaniko
@evan
I'm not an OSM expert but that should not be to hard to do.
Let's ask to real OSM people.
@Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber @cquest
What do you think about that ?
Evan Prodromou
@cquest @bakaniko @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber we also have a geosocial vocabulary built into ActivityPub, which supports "check ins", like Foursquare and Facebook do. It's actually got three activity types: `Arrive`, `Leave`, and `Travel`.
Evan Prodromou
@mwfc agreed, or Sina Weibo
…might work for coffee…
@evan
WeChat would be interesting.
Evan Prodromou
@ileoo I just tried it; it sent me to a waitlist page. 😔
Ilkka
@evan I think https://mozilla.social already allows Firefox Id to login?
Evan Prodromou
@oldmanspidey fixed, thank you
spidey :Clairen_0: :Hodan_0:
@evan yet?
Evan Prodromou
@schmidt_fu @cquest @bakaniko @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber Oh, interesting. I can't say I understand the OSM data model very well; I kind of assumed that nodes, relations and ways would get updated but keep their ID. You're saying that, if I added a new translation to "Antwerp", or an altitude or a link to Wikidata or something, it would get a whole new ID?
Florian Schmidt
@evan
Interesting idea! How do you navigate longevity?
On Wikipedia, there would be an article named "Antwerp", and it would likely stay there for a long time. On #OSM, in my understanding anyone could delete it at any time, and it could be re-created by several people with different attributes. Is the data model really suitable for providing external references?
@cquest @bakaniko @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber
Tim Chambers
Well first step is that @wikidata does exist on the Fedi.
I’m encouraging @wikimediafoundation folks to consider deeper integration than the rel=me support they have built into #Wikimedia to date and bet they would love to hear ideas.
Evan Prodromou
@tchambers @andypiper you don't understand what I mean.
I'd like every Wikidata data item to have an URL that returns an Activity Streams 2.0 representation of that item. So when I make a `Read` activity for Naomi Klein's book Doppelganger (Q122850573), I can include its ID as the `object`.
Evan Prodromou
@cquest @schmidt_fu @bakaniko @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber meh, that's probably fine.
Christian Quest 🌍
@evan @schmidt_fu @bakaniko @Bristow_69 @tykayn @vinber the id remains as long as you’re updating the object, but sometimes it’s not enough like when a POI defined by a node is improved and becomes a way
Evan Prodromou
@astrojuanlu what's your question?
Juan Luis
@evan Forwarding this question about Mastodon compatibility https://social.juanlu.space/@astrojuanlu/111600486194894897
Tim Chambers
@evan @andypiper
That’s great. That is the sort of deeper integration I was advocating they consider…. cc: @mediawiki
Evan Prodromou
@astrojuanlu 1. No 2. Submit patches
Juan Luis
@evan Do you know by any chance if there's an issue on the Mastodon tracker about supporting other object types?
and
How can we keep innovating in the use of ActivityPub while there's tension with staying compatible with Mastodon, which only supports a very narrow subset of object types?
Tim Chambers
One definition is here: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Main_Page
Jan Ainali
@evan @tchambers @andypiper
Why only Wikidata? Since it is the main namespace of MediaWiki, it could be on all pages.
Sebastian Lasse
@ainali
because wikidata is the primary id mechanism and has a very similar data model to AS which I map completely and it lists commons and all wikibase pages.
Described what we did here in the answer to Max https://digitalcourage.social/@maxlath@mastodon.social/111601875594376185
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper The idea is to use the structured data in Wikidata to represent places, books, movies, podcasts, services, apps in the ActivityPub world.
Here's an example of a Place represented by an URL from a (fictional) Wikidata activitypub gateway:
https://gist.github.com/evanp/762f0c5dbd0524d54822bf534bbd7008
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper here's an example of a geosocial "checkin" event, using the "Arrive" activity type.
https://gist.github.com/evanp/355cfed3e74cf0ec3a4fdf3c9dcf80af
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper Here's a representation of the movie "Barbie", Q55436290.
https://gist.github.com/evanp/bf8b4cc7f2487fdc6f9318155020c62a
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper and here's an example activity where I share that I saw "Barbie".
https://gist.github.com/evanp/916ddd285b3162cdaed5757672ceb13f
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper I think it's easier to use a single Wikidata item for the movie "Barbie" than to use each of the Wikipedia articles in each language (or the Wikiquote article, etc.).
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper Maybe Wikispecies could work here, too, although we don't have a dedicated type for a species in ActivityPub. For the other projects, I think we'd treat a page as the Page activitypub type, not as the object referred to in the page. Here's an example activity where I read a page on English Wikipedia:
https://gist.github.com/evanp/d91ee06f08534d39f09de5f03cf87513
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper so, I guess I'd say, I would prefer to have Wikidata first, and Wikipedia and other projects later.
Evan Prodromou
@FenTiger @ainali @tchambers @andypiper yes. I haven't done any hacking on Toolserver or whatever the current iteration is at Wikimedia, but that would probably be the right place to do it.
Mike P
@evan @ainali @tchambers @andypiper Maybe this could be done - or at least prototyped - with some kind of proxy.
Evan Prodromou
@ainali @tchambers @andypiper We get pretty close with the JSON-LD output for an entity, btw:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Special:EntityData/Q55436290.jsonld
I think that'd take a lot more work for AP developers, though.
Evan Prodromou
@KevinMarks @andypiper cool, I'll check it out.
Kevin Marks
@andypiper @evan it uses openlibrary.org as the basis and treats them as social objects
Andy Piper
@KevinMarks @evan “build on” or “import from”?
Kevin Marks
@evan doesn't bookwyrm.social already build on Open Library?
GNU social JP is a social network, courtesy of GNU social JP管理人. It runs on GNU social, version 2.0.2-dev, available under the GNU Affero General Public License.
All GNU social JP content and data are available under the Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 license.