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kuro-chan (sun_eater@goreslut.xyz)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:18:45 JST kuro-chan

ehrm, someone now a good xmpp client cos converse is bad and ain't loading and my phone is out of battery so i can't use conversations and and ehrm

In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:18:45 JST from goreslut.xyz permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:18:44 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  
  @sun_eater >good XMPP client
  
  Heh, funni
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:18:44 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:26:11 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  @NEETzsche @sun_eater Monical chat, monal, dino.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:26:11 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:34:12 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @maija @sun_eater Converse was such a piece of shit I had to fix a bug just to get it to run at all when I first tried it. It failed outright at startup. At least they accepted my PR to fix it.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:34:12 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:34:13 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @sun_eater like conversejs is the project inverse.chat is the official instance
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:34:13 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:34:14 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  
  @sun_eater dino is cool on linux but its kinda retarded and fetches THE ENTIRE CHAT HISTORY when you first add your account, and gives notifications for it all, atleast last i used it
  gajim is popular, i havent had good luck but thats what everyone seems to use
  i use psi+ because of autism its kinda fucky
  also converse.js/inverse.chat
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:34:14 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:39:09 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @maija @sun_eater Maybe it got better since I used it. I submitted my pull request in September of 2021
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:39:09 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:39:10 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  @NEETzsche @sun_eater its worked well for me but also id say user experience is far more important than server. a server admin knows what they are doing. the user often does not. and its one of the few good xmpp clients out there. i would apply some custom css personally though, a few quality of life tweaks
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:39:10 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:47:15 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @sun_eater @maija My little one-liner brought it from not working at all on my XMPP instance to working, but being a clunky piece of shit.
  
  My experience with federated chat services has been rather terrible. They all sucked. The UI/UX just can't compete with commercial, proprietary services like Discord or Telegram and I think it's because the people who built them thought exclusively about abstract back-end ideas and not at all about things like the user experience.
  
  This is not a problem I've seen with other FOSS/federated services, like the one we're on now. It's specifically chat services that suck ass.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:47:15 JST permalink
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  kuro-chan (sun_eater@goreslut.xyz)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:47:16 JST kuro-chan
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @NEETzsche @maija probably, converse always worked fine for me
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:47:16 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:54:32 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @sun_eater @maija Matrix makes for an excellent bridge because the back end of it is legitimately well designed, allowing one to pass messages with all of metadata peculiar to basically any chat service that actually exists or one can dream up, it's just that all of the clients are dog shit
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:54:32 JST permalink
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  kuro-chan (sun_eater@goreslut.xyz)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:54:33 JST kuro-chan
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @NEETzsche @maija yeah, the closest to a good experience i have had was matrix and it's still bad
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 17:54:33 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:02:45 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @maija@comp.lain.la Implying discord has good UI/UX I lol'd :laugh_about_it:
  Discord sucks balls.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:02:45 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:02:47 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Dushman
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @dushman @sun_eater @maija Discord UI is actually usable, XMPP/Matrix is not. If you want to criticize Discord you're going to have to criticize its administration, because the way it actually works is highly intuitive to normal people who don't have a computer science degree
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:02:47 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:03:23 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @maija@comp.lain.la
  XMPP works just fine for me.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:03:23 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:04:14 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @maija @sun_eater Converse sucks because it does not keep you signed in
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:04:14 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:04:51 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Dushman
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @dushman @sun_eater @maija Yeah? You realize there's more to user experience than merely being able to send messages right? You are aware of that are you not?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:04:51 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:05:45 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija Last time toe used xmpp was *looks at clock* a long time
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:05:45 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:05:46 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @dcc@annihilation.social as much as I dislike discord its still miles better than anything elseIs this fella for real? :laugh_about_it:
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:05:46 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:05:47 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @NEETzsche @maija @sun_eater
  agreed
  as much as I dislike discord its still miles better than anything else
  hell even fucking rocketchat is more stable than xmpp most times
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:05:47 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:09:43 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @maija @sun_eater It does not keep you signed in (i even hosted it my self)
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:09:43 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:09:44 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  - ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  @dcc @sun_eater works on my machine
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:09:44 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:10:56 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche I mean all the phone clients work (i got my entire family on xmpp) gamji and dino are also good.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:10:56 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:10:57 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche fosstard tbh
  you know i mostly use xmpp dush, they're right, most the clients suck and compatibility is kinda ass. sure its usuable normally but its not intuitive and only like conversations and its forks are actually proper good, which is a mobile only client
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:10:57 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:12:56 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija Werks for me :pepe_cofe: but anyways xmpp is way easier to use than matrix(i do in fact talk to people outside the gober net)
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:12:56 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:12:57 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @dcc@annihilation.social @maija@comp.lain.la @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social
  Nah dino sucks balls. Worst chat client of any kind I have ever used. Vala is a joke.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:12:57 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:13:08 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  - ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  @dcc @sun_eater idk what to say, maybe browser settings? ive not had this issue
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:13:08 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:13:08 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  - Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  @maija @sun_eater firefox and chromium
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:13:08 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:18:15 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Either i give my phone number or convince them to use xmpp.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:18:15 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:18:16 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @dcc @theorytoe @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche yeah i would never be able to get normies using matrix, but some use xmpp with me as its easy to go, yeah this is the best way to contact me and point them to blabber.im and a host or something
  signal is ofc ideal if you can trust your phone number but not all can, like ive given xmpp to people i've just met or from dating apps
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:18:16 JST permalink
  Attachments
  1. Domain not in remote thumbnail source whitelist: blabber.im
    
    blabber.im Messenger
    
    Ein Jabber/XMPP Client für Android Smartphones, der für ein einzigartiges mobiles Erlebnis optimiert wurde.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:44 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Did you try dino yet?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:44 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:45 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dushman @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija again
  for you :ehh:
  ive never found a good desktop client for xmpp that works without issue
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:45 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:46 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dushman @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija
  I am for real
  again I dont think any normal person can use these chat services without having a stroke
  hell even matrix is a smoother experience for most people
  
  let alone that there are zero good desktop clients that work well for xmpp, let alone web ones that are even passable
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:46 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:46 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  Nah gajim is good. Just werks, never had issues with it. It does not eat half your ram and crash like dino.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:46 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:47 JST meso
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche dushman be like i cant use systemd it uses 10mb of ram but an xmpp client written in python that uses more RAM than webshit is fine
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:47 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:48 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche > Eats like 200mb RAM so not that heavy too.
  bro are you for real right now
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:48 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:49 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @maija@comp.lain.la @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social
  OMEMO and all works perfect on gajim. Eats like 200mb RAM so not that heavy too.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:49 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:50 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @maija@comp.lain.la @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social
  Gajim on desktop is great
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:19:50 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:20:33 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @meso @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche dushman is extremely biased foss evangelist. he's incapable of seeing shit out the eyes of a normal user and will criticize things he dislikes, but make endless defence for his foss obsession because it technically works at all. never in this proess does it click in his brain a normal user is not gonna give a fuck about whatever niche reasons he has and wont make such defense.
  dush needs to learn to be critical on everything and not just make do while considering it good. probably software of his will have bad ui/ux aswell stemming from this
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:20:33 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:22:29 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Uh huh, you talk to only zommers or something?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:22:29 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:22:30 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche wierdly enough I have had the opposite experience :ehh:
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:22:30 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:15 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @dushman so here's how a good user experience goes when it comes to media. You download the app, you type in a username and a password, and because we're talking about a federated service we're also going to take the leap of adding in a domain name for the instance, and then it just works. From there, you don't have to do anything. You don't have to set everything to Auto download. You don't have to fiddle with the settings. You don't have to download f-droid and then download this other thing from f droid. Joining a channel is one click experience. The list goes on.
  
  That's what a good user experience is like and that's what literally none of these federated chat services even attempt to offer. They just don't. I've used these things and getting it to function is always this endeavor where there's at least like three fucking work around you have to do before you can get it to send a picture or whatever
  
  @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @maija
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:15 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:16 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  non issue when you make it auto download imo
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:16 JST permalink
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  kuro-chan (sun_eater@goreslut.xyz)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:18 JST kuro-chan
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @NEETzsche @maija i iwsh it let me actually open media without having to download it and open it in my file browser tho
  that feels retarded
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:18 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:48 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche sir 90% of the population that does not use sms for messaging are zoomers
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:48 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:48 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Lol
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:23:48 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:25:29 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater Yet even a normie can use it, your making up excuses no mater how you frame it.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:25:29 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:25:39 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche im not even joking
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:25:39 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:25:39 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Yes i know
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:25:39 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:28:44 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @dcc No, normies can't and don't use it, that's the thing. Normies have a hard time understanding the CONCEPT of federation. Like, it just doesn't fucking register, and then most of the time when it does, they don't get why it's a good thing. You tell them about a new service and they call it an "app." They don't understand and they have no desire to understand. In fact, in my experience they have a desire to not understand. They give negative fucks about this topic and measure how good a service is based on how many fields they need to fill out and how many things they need to click before they get the desired output, the fewer the better.
  
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:28:44 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:29:41 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  the question is can they use it *without* your help in telling them what to do
  
  they answer 11 times out of 10 is no
  definietively
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:29:41 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:29:41 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Well its not like your not going to show them how to use it. No matter how you learn how to use a app you still have to learn how to use apps.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:29:41 JST permalink
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  kuro-chan (sun_eater@goreslut.xyz)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:33:32 JST kuro-chan
  in reply to
  @dcc @theorytoe @maija @dushman @NEETzsche not really tbh, all the problem on making it work just makes you wanna public execute whoever coded it
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:33:32 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:33:46 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche "It just works" well no there is still things to mess with, again you still need the learn the interface and how to add people. If people dont want to learn they just wont its not some bs accessible its just they dont care to.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:33:46 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:33:47 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  discored is literally get an account and boom, everything works ootb
  no settings, so weird handles to remember no omemo encryption
  just chat
  
  matrix/xmpp wishes it could be that simple, but architecturally its impossible
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:33:47 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:34:20 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @sun_eater @theorytoe @maija @dushman @NEETzsche Yes really tbh
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:34:20 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:35:18 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater Refer to my previous post, if they dont want to learn they just wont.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:35:18 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:37:59 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Norimes learned how to use facebook, there not normies now?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:37:59 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:38:00 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  if they want to learn then they arent normies :ehh:
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:38:00 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:42:40 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche You need a facebook to use messenger, im not on a high horse i know how people react to you wanting them to use something else than what they already know.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:42:40 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:42:41 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  ah yes because facebook is exactly the same to a chat service and is a 100% fair comparison
  
  holy shit bro how high on that seat are you
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:42:41 JST permalink
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  cipote :bishrexual: (teratology@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:44:50 JST cipote :bishrexual:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater you think that’s bad? People in my life don’t understand what a harddrive is because of da clouudd
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:44:50 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:44:50 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @teratology Normies give negative fucks about the technicals because they would rather think about literally anything else. They just want to get to the part where they get to chat with their pal from work/school or they get to see funny picture or whatever. They view having to comprehend or learn anything as an imposition against them, and frankly when you think about it that outlook makes perfect sense.
  
  Imagine if car guys unironically expected everybody to become an auto mechanic just so they can drive their fucking car. "Welcome to Delta airlines, please have your degree in aeronautical engineering ready as you board the plane."
  
  That's what FOSS spergs do when we try to shill them on Linux or on Stallmanite distinctions between libre and gratis or whatever the fuck else.
  
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:44:50 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:46:03 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch
  in reply to
  If I have to put too much work into something I consider more a leisurely activity I tend to get really frustrated with it. It isn't so much normie as it is human to be handed a medical form and feel a rising desire to come back with a rifle and makeshift flamethrower after realizing it is over ten pages long.
  
  Just thinking about such a scenario is migraine inducing.
  
  That said the first half of your statement stands. Every time I download something for my desktop and see the website call it an app it makes me want to stab them in the eye with a fountain pen.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:46:03 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:48:35 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @maija @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  you have to ease people in
  because with how things are setup now its not easy to ease people in
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:48:35 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:48:36 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater i usually give the contact and then recommend blabber.im as a client and tell them to put a certain server, they wont know what that means or really care. we get on, we talk, they inevitably ask what that meant or what this is, and i will make a comparison to "oh its like email where you can have a gmail or yahoo or whatever and still email each other" and they get it
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:48:36 JST permalink
  Attachments
  1. Domain not in remote thumbnail source whitelist: blabber.im
    
    blabber.im Messenger
    
    Ein Jabber/XMPP Client für Android Smartphones, der für ein einzigartiges mobiles Erlebnis optimiert wurde.
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:49:39 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  
  nobody I knows uses fb messenger...
  just groupme & sms
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:49:39 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:49:39 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche You dont know enough old people, many of them use both facebook and messenger, or viber or signal. Its not the app its just they dont have a reason to learn it (unless you convince them)
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:49:39 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:50:01 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Yes you do have to butter up the idea to them
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:50:01 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:51:05 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche have you ever used snapchat?
  normies will learn lmao, learn some pretty horribly designed shit
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:51:05 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:52:04 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche Mf'er people even use instagram to talk to eachother
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:52:04 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:29 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @meso @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @teratology sounds like your just anticapitalist dumbass
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:29 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:30 JST meso
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @teratology im commie based on my existing principles not based on Le economics I just really hate corporations and authority that's all
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:30 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:31 JST meso
  in reply to
  @teratology @maija @NEETzsche @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @theorytoe though on the other end you have the most consumerist, pro-proprietary "commies" in existence. like twitch streamers
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:31 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche repeated this.
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:31 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @meso @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @teratology yeah but he's polish, hard to be anything but a real commie when its in your recent history
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:31 JST permalink
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  cipote :bishrexual: (teratology@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:32 JST cipote :bishrexual:
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @meso us commies tend to be the hardest strictest FOSS bros ngl
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:53:32 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:54:50 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @dcc No you don't understand. They don't give a fuck about these services. They give a fuck about you and they want to contact you so they're willing to humor this piece of shit service that's a pain in their ass to use because they want to contact you and you are a sperg that makes impositions that are super important to you but are actively annoying to normies and they just put up with a certain amount of it because in spite of how abrasive you probably are they still care about you to some extent.
  
  Normies just want to send the message asking if you want to see the Barbie movie with them tonight or post their stupid minions memes. I don't think you even partially appreciate the absolute state of the normie. Try talking to somebody with a 100 IQ who changes tires for a living or is a mortgage loan officer or some shit. Their use of the internet begins and ends trying to find a cool explosion or trying to find a cute picture of a cat or whatever. Try talking to somebody who touches grass every day and not just when they absolutely have to. They fucking hate computers and "apps."
  
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:54:50 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:01 JST meso
  in reply to
  @teratology @NEETzsche @dcc @dushman @maija @sun_eater @theorytoe i have an image for this
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:01 JST permalink
  Attachments
  1. Untitled attachment
    https://the.asbestos.cafe/media/ee15cc83fd09b39e31199b756f4e275cedb19610eaadb7cee0bec2a18b69800c.png
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:48 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche are you high its literally the one unique one
  its nothing like other social medias there arent even pages
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:48 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:49 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @maija @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche
  well yeah, but its still "familiar" in the sense that it functions similar to most other social medias out there
  
  again its just familiarity
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:49 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:57 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @dcc @theorytoe @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche yeah they do.
  im making a point about design, insta dms are easy and generic. snapchat is complicated and theres weird details like saving messages and unexplained gestures on how to do everything and some things are just really shitty jank with no real reason for it
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:56:57 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:59:05 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater I said this already, what the hell do you think "not want to learn" means. They only use these apps because other people use them.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:59:05 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:59:12 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @maija @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche :marseyshrug: ive only seen bits an pieces so im probably projecting to a degree
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 18:59:12 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:00:24 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @dcc okay sorry
  
  @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:00:24 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:01:23 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater Its fine
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:01:23 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:03:20 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @dushman I love command lines and in most cases even prefer them over GUIs. However, and this is an important thing to understand, is that I have a theory of mind. I understand that my preferences aren't everybody else's preferences. I am a computer nerd. I like computers. That's not normal. Most people fucking hate computers. They either regard computers as this pain in the ass thing that won't print their TPS report, or as this literal magic box that solves their problem for them. It's not even just dumb people who do this, but anybody who isn't actively a computer sperg.
  
  This is why all of these workarounds and all of these elaborate rigmaroles to get XMPP or Matrix or whatever to fucking work filter them. You shouldn't have to memorize the Konami code to send cat videos.
  
  @theorytoe @meso @dcc @sun_eater @maija
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:03:20 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:03:21 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @maija@comp.lain.la @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social
  I mean the stuff I make for my own needs is CLI only lol
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:03:21 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:06:19 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @maija You're about to get mega mad but I think all of that wacky "gestures" shit is actually quite intuitive to a normie relative to someone who prefers a command line. I think the kind of person who actually likes computers has a significantly different neurology, quite literally.
  
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:06:19 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:06:20 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche yeah no its horrible
  like its ok once your used to it but the design is just awful, and you have to swipe from a particular direction tjust to see your friends, which if your going through and miss something you cant go back you gotta reopen from their chat, you cant open chat till youve seen all pics one by one, the chat requires you tap every message you want to say lest it gets autodeleted after you both see it, you cant turn it off only set to 24 hours, everyones just taps everything they send. sending messages photos has to be from the initial camera screen unless its individual and lets say ok snapchat, filters, you can choose and fine good, works fine. also theres two ways, one swiping only has a few shitty ones and the filter menu after you take the picture has others. what if you want to do it before its taken or use literally half of them? you gotta open another menu. like one? you cant save it and lthe listings change regularly, you have to search from ANOTHER MENU every time
  i love filters i love trying to look cute and honestly this is my only normie social media as the incentives to keep using it does unironically push you into keeping touch with friends, and i love taking photos of things and sending to everyone anyways. but god damn this ui is ass it took me so long to figure this shit out and i still get confused! and im young and a tech nerd new and difficult ui comes easy to me!
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:06:20 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:51 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @dushman >for an XMPP client that actually works well
  
  I'm willing to challenge you to find me an XMPP client that actually works well. For it to qualify as "works well" it needs to require no more than twice as many clicks and no more than twice as many fields to fill in as it does to get started on Discord. We're going to go from fresh install of Windows 10 with no programs installed having no account to viewing cat video responding with minions meme.
  
  If it doesn't just work as-described I'm going to get on a call with you and have you tell me exactly what to click on. You're going to have to think of this in terms of resource management, where if you try something but it doesn't fix the problem, you still used up clicks to try to troubleshoot it. It's going to be like a game of chess: "if I have to open up this menu, it'll take five clicks... Hmmm..."
  
  Yes, all of those settings you have to change count toward this total. Yes, all of those other programs you need to install to get it to work count toward this total. I'm willing to give it twice as many clicks etc as Discord and I'm still damn sure XMPP won't make it.
  
  This should be a lesson in how the normie thinks, and to be clear, to somebody who thinks a good time is having a barbecue or going fishing, this isn't an even close to wrong way to view the matter.
  
  @theorytoe @meso @dcc @sun_eater @maija
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:51 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:52 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  I can stomach 176mb of ram usage for an xmpp client that actually works well
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:52 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:53 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  It sure is way less than discord or element lol
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:53 JST permalink
  Attachments
  1. Untitled attachment
    https://den.raccoon.quest/files/0b06e0fb-72e5-4dfb-8dc3-96f3a531c742
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:54 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija psi+, pidgin, using an IRC to XMPP bridge (IRC clients are good unlike XMPP ones)
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:54 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:54 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  I've used psi+ but it doesn't have proper chat hist fetching. Gajim is smoother to use imo.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:54 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:55 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @maija@comp.lain.la @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social
  I mean do you have a better option lel?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:14:55 JST permalink
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:03 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso Gamji on windows 10 only needs two to four clicks (i set it up on a normie frens pc)
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:03 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:13 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @maija I'm on the same page. I remember installing Snapchat years ago and wondering what the fuck is going on, and then uninstalling it because I couldn't figure it out in 10 minutes. I hated this thing.
  
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:13 JST permalink
  
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:13 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  this mf so retarded
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:13 JST permalink
  
  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:14 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater oh yeah no it is more intuitive than a commandline and i know i just struggle with it more, not used to it ive always avoided them, but its not even explained is the point. theres a ton of different areas you swipe to on a grid your moving across, and you cant always go all directions but sometimes you can go some. and sometimes things are buttons instead. and sometimes you have to swipe in certain parts of the screen. and sometimes you have to go through multiple menus for basic behaviour, or go in a menu and then swipe, just so much shit and absolutely zero is explained your just tossed in an extremely unintuitive environment and expected to figure it out. much like dushmans friends when being recommended gajim
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:14 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:14 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  it's shared memory
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:14 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:15 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija idles at 152MB RAM usage you fucking retard
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:15 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:16 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  Idles at 540 mb reserved RAM usage. It's the exact same shit on windows.
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:16 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:17 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  I just use it sometimes in a browser to talk to some friends who are only on there. Though it sure as hell eats waaaaaaay more than 86 lol.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:17 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:17 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija it doesn't. it uses 100MB max. on windows anyway, where it's most optimized and most users are. either way it will use 180MB worst case scenario, about the same as Gajim
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:17 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:18 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la Discord uses 86MByeah nice bait
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:18 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:19 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija it doesn't. Discord uses 86MB
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:17:19 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:18:27 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @dcc@annihilation.social @maija@comp.lain.la @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe
  time to purge the devil
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:18:27 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:18:28 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @dcc@annihilation.social @maija@comp.lain.la @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe
  Do you not know the difference between shared and reserved memory? Reserved is the actual amount of RAM being physically used by a process.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:18:28 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:18:29 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @NEETzsche @dcc @maija @sun_eater @theorytoe dawg you are really bad at trolling
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:18:29 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:21:11 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  Meso once again proves he doesn't know what he's talking about lol
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:21:11 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:21:12 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija you are an absolute fucking retard then why did you show the non "reserved" memory for Gajim you absolute fucking idiot
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:21:12 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:22:10 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @meso this is giving such leeway, but yes this is basic UX principles why does no fosstard get it! i used to talk to the dev of that one other crossplatform fedi client i forget the name, and he cared about ui/ux and it helped the project alot.
  nobody else i've met doing free software has cared in the slightest about ui/ux unless their some gnome user often praising pretty arbitrary just as bad choices
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:22:10 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  Lina Inver?e (lina@eientei.org)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:10 JST Lina Inver?e
  in reply to
  @meso @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche psi rocks :ryukolove:
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:10 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:11 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija yeah so Discord is using 150MB of reserved aka physical memory. retard
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:11 JST permalink
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  1. Untitled attachment
    https://the.asbestos.cafe/media/ca31679fecfb6cd5d1e9740754330760c770d4f763290877f981e28d869d717c.png
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:12 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  yeah give or take 170-210mb of reserved aka physical memory
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:12 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:13 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija you said Discord uses 540MB of memory and Gajim uses 179MB you absolute fucking retard
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:13 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:14 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @meso@the.asbestos.cafe @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @maija@comp.lain.la
  I am bewildered you are able to run a server without knowing how htop works
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:14 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:15 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija so if discord is using 546MB of RAM, then gaim is using... 1059MB!
  
  either way you're lying and 209MB is still more than 152MB, Discord is literally lighter than Gajim
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:26:15 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:27:31 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @maija Gleason has cared because his target audience is a bunch of retarded TERF boomers from the United Kingdom. They, being British, have an IQ of around 80 on average from being drunk 24/7, which makes them great candidates for user testing.
  
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:27:31 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:28:31 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater i still use it for the social network and for the filters, which sure is a basic ass normie reason but yes very much so thats why anybody uses it! ux is important but also normies can learn if pressured by their friends being on there or some gimmick like filters
  which ofc xmpp doesnt have. it had the network affect and got really popular in the mid 2000s! but thats even more reason its not coming back its old news, trend died
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:28:31 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:30:14 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @meso Btw muting the thread :pepe_tea:
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:30:14 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:30:15 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @meso @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche i wonder why? i know some clients use webkit or webengine for the chat window, does gajim, and could that be adding weight?
  or is it just the fact discord is webshit which has effort to optimize nowadays and gajim is python
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:30:15 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:36:20 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @maija Yeah, it's why I opened by pointing out that the UI issues don't apply to all free and open source software, just chat services for some reason. All FOSS chat services are trash due to their trash UI. Nobody gives a fuck how much RAM it uses as long as it isn't like a terabyte.
  
  @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:36:20 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:36:21 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @meso thats true
  i dont personally like the design of soapbox, that whole, what is it, category? genre? of webuis is something i dont really like, but it is pretty intuitive in my usage and definitely inline with other major social medias
  tbf though mastodon and pleroma are pretty decent too, back in 2020 some normie friend wanted to check out what im doing and had no issue figuring out how to use pleroma
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:36:21 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:42:28 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @theorytoe Neither is going to happen because in the mind of anybody who designs these services, abstract shit like how well the e2ee works are really the only important things to them. You have to understand that the people who designed these things actually believe the CIA is hellbent on monitoring their friend chat group where the most illegal thing they do is sell weed to each other
  
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:42:28 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:42:29 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso exactly this
  I dont think its just in a good place at the moment
  
  it either needs to be improved heavily, or someone really needs to take a very critical lens when making a new service/protocol
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 19:42:29 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:35:05 JST meso
  in reply to
  @dushman @theorytoe @dcc @sun_eater @NEETzsche @maija the feds are gangstalking you and me and everyone else, you have to be a retard not to know that
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:35:05 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:35:06 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche@iddqd.social @theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe @dcc@annihilation.social @maija@comp.lain.la @sun_eater@goreslut.xyz @meso@the.asbestos.cafe
  I just prefer not having my data sold to corporations. Most people don't unironically believe the feds are gangstalking them.
  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:35:06 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:38:39 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  And I just don’t like FOSS niggers wasting my time having to futz with their Python spaghetti code just so I can tell them their other Python spaghetti code is broken. Which, yes, is what FOSS chat services amount to. I reiterate my challenge to see how many clicks it takes to go from new install of Windows 10 to posting/viewing cat memes, comparing it to Discord or Telegram.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:38:39 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:49:22 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  We can use a phone if you really like but I’m going to count every touch as a click instead. And I guarantee you, Discord/Telegram will still have less than half.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:49:22 JST permalink
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  m0xEE (m0xee@social.librem.one)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:49:23 JST m0xEE
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche
  > new install of Windows 10
  Do normies even use desktop systems these days? A phone and an Android tablet or an iPad is what they have. Having a "computer" is already a geeky thing.
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:49:23 JST permalink
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  m0xEE (m0xee@social.librem.one)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:59:06 JST m0xEE
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche
  No, I get your point, it's just a side note, but it might make a difference as they can get Telegram and Discord in Microsoft store, but they won't find Element there. On a phone, installing Element and signing up for an account on matrix.org would take roughly the same amount of clicks/touches I think.
  I'm not sure what it would be for XMPP. Skype, while commercial, is a mess in this regard — it asks a lot of questions.
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:59:06 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:59:06 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  The inconvenience of installing the damn thing is part of the issue, though. The biggest compromise I can do is installing F-Droid before we begin. But that’s it. That’s all you’re getting.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 20:59:06 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:05:26 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  The important thing to consider is that the inconvenience of setting this up is measurable and real, and there’s only so much coping one can do about it before the final answer is “no this is trash” to someone who isn’t invested ideologically in this.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:05:26 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:10:18 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - Dushman
  Okay post the client and we will test this.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:10:18 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:10:19 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  @NEETzsche@iddqd.social
  same amount of time as installing discord, logging in and starting a chat
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:10:19 JST permalink
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  Dushman (dushman@den.raccoon.quest)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:10:20 JST Dushman
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  @NEETzsche@iddqd.social :cat_blehhhhh:
  login>open contact list>pick one>start chatting
  not rocket science
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:10:20 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:16:37 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  - NEETzsche
  - Dushman
  So what is your preferred client?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:16:37 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:17:29 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  The backends of XMPP/Matrix are solid. The criticism is against the UI/UX, and that criticism is real and it counts.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:17:29 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:17:30 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @meso theres well done xmpp servers atleast, like ejabberd is corporate and very well made and optimized, and they release their basic quite complete version as foss just missing some corporate specific stuff
  matrix is ofc literally python. the server. the servers in fucking python. what is wrong with them?
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:17:30 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:46:42 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  So, here’s me getting into my Discord server. I did have to do a CAPTCHA and enter a birthdate, but notice how it dropped me directly into the server. I also didn’t have to install an app. It’s clear from your video that Element has seen a lot of improvement, which is to their credit.
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:46:42 JST permalink
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  m0xEE (m0xee@social.librem.one)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:46:43 JST m0xEE
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche
  I don't think it's as bad as some try to paint it — I use Matrix for communicating with my non tech-savvy friends and family — all of them managed to signup without any help from me, including my mom and girls who prefer Instagram as their primary social media, none of them are bad with computers though.
  My mom often complains that it takes a couple of seconds to decrypt bigger images — but that's what Telegram doesn't even have.
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:46:43 JST permalink
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  m0xEE (m0xee@social.librem.one)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:46:44 JST m0xEE
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  It took longer than I had expected and yes, they do have e-mail verification now — and that was the longest part. Average user probably won't be using a VPN exit point for signing up and won't have to enter ReCAPTCHA, and will definitely not get prompted about using ntfy for notifications. "Help us improve…" — it's good that they even ask.
  Overall — not bad at all.
  Can anyone do Discord?
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:46:44 JST permalink
  Attachments
  1. A video of me installing Element and signing up for a new account on matrix.org.
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:51:24 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  Yes, I’d say this is a step backwards. There are other UI advantages to Discord, like most notably the “servers” (guilds) structure where one server has many channels and roles and blah blah blah. I play TTRPGs online and that’s a big boon.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:51:24 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:51:25 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @m0xee @meso what happened to discord creating temporary accounts? i remember back when i got on this was a 0 step onboarding process, youd open the link to a server and there you are, temporary account, nothing to do. and then from there you could change nick/pfp/set a handle and add your email to verify it
  that was good onboarding.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 21:51:25 JST permalink
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  m0xEE (m0xee@social.librem.one)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:13:48 JST m0xEE
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche
  I think they also have some embeddable thing — so, same temporary accounts. I'm just not sure it works for matrix.org
  And they of course could've got rid of the terms of service and telemetry questions and do it like Discord does "By clicking okay you agree to this and that…" — but it's good that they didn't, I'd probably not trust them with such an "improvement". Overall it's perfectly balanced now, not night and day difference.
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:13:48 JST permalink
  Attachments
  1. Untitled attachment
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:13:48 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  I’ve considered writing a federated Discord clone with the guilds structure and so on but it’s just such a time-consuming task. But at this point I think the thing that will save federated services is focusing on UI/UX, and Pleroma/forks have been doing great at that.
  I think the next step here is rich presence, but for these chat services they still need a lot of work. They need to implement something to the effect of the guilds structure from Discord, they still need custom emoji reacts, and so on.
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:13:48 JST permalink
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  m0xEE (m0xee@social.librem.one)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:13:49 JST m0xEE
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche
  Element has also seen a downgrade in fact. Like I said, when I've been signing up and it was still called Riot — there was no email verification, they probably just couldn't come up with better anti-spam measure. I think you can not have one on your server.And I've just checked — they do have invite links, I didn't even think of that as I've never used this function. And they even offer a selection of clients if you follow such a link
  @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:13:49 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:48:47 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @m0xee @meso
  I am one of the opinion that putting federation into the chat service might be more of a hassle than its worth
  especially for instant messaging
  
  but I could be entirely wrong
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:48:47 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:48:47 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  I think they’re just doing it wrong
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:48:47 JST permalink
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  NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:55:58 JST NEETzsche
  in reply to
  @theorytoe It's an issue of how it's designed. I usually frame this sort of dichotomy as top down versus bottom up, but I think this time it's best to frame it in terms of inside out versus outside in.
  
  Let me elaborate on what I mean by that. Inside out is when you design the backend and work your way outward to the UI. Outside in is when you design the UI and then work your way into the back end. I think the mistake they made was leaning very heavily into the former. They really fleshed out the back end. But then they only implemented front ends that are sort of a proof of concept, and in the case of Element, they're now just starting to escape that problem.
  
  Considering how events work in matrix, it's actually feasible to implement a Discord like system outright. Just create a new client that sends Events that are designed in that way. For example, if you frame a channel as a guild, just start issuing Events that specify which subchannel they're in. That sort of thing.
  
  The more I think about this, the more I'm coming to the idea that we can salvage Matrix by just writing a new client that abandons this pretense of being compatible with any of the other clients, and we just make up a new Event structure that suits our needs more.
  
  Let's sleep on that for a bit. This could be genius. This could be total retardation. Let's not jump to conclusions.
  
  @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @m0xee @meso
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:55:58 JST permalink
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  T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll: (theorytoe@ak.kyaruc.moe)'s status on Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:55:59 JST T man :sex: :puffgiga: :puffpowerroll:
  in reply to
  @NEETzsche @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @m0xee @meso
  thats honestly what I think too
  but it seems like people end up getting attached to the protocol too much and forget about the service itself
  
  In conversation Monday, 07-Aug-2023 22:55:59 JST permalink
  
  NEETzsche likes this.
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  Sexy Moon (moon@shitposter.club)'s status on Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:11 JST Sexy Moon
  in reply to
  @meso @theorytoe @dcc @maija @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @teratology men don't pay women for sex, they pay women to go away after they nut
  
  In conversation Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:11 JST permalink
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  meso (meso@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:12 JST meso
  in reply to
  @teratology @maija @NEETzsche @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @theorytoe bought a 3 million house and still has to go to brothels lmao, truly a worthless person with no personal qualities
  
  In conversation Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:12 JST permalink
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  cipote :bishrexual: (teratology@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:13 JST cipote :bishrexual:
  in reply to
  @maija @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @meso he paid for “sex work” at a brothel that was confirmed to be trafficking women
  
  In conversation Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:13 JST permalink
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  cipote :bishrexual: (teratology@the.asbestos.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:14 JST cipote :bishrexual:
  in reply to
  @meso @NEETzsche @dcc @dushman @maija @sun_eater @theorytoe well to be fair twitch socialists like Hasan Piker literally rape women at brothels and think they’re woke for it lmao
  
  In conversation Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:14 JST permalink
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  Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc) (maija@comp.lain.la)'s status on Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:14 JST Maija (Under 7666's Bed Arc)
  in reply to
  @teratology @theorytoe @dcc @dushman @sun_eater @NEETzsche @meso what? i love hating hasan please elaborate
  
  In conversation Tuesday, 08-Aug-2023 08:18:14 JST permalink

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