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1. Embed this notice
   Bricky (thatbrickster@shitposter.world)'s status on Thursday, 08-May-2025 19:49:15 JST Bricky
   A smartphone will never be truly free, not for long anyway.
   • pistolero likes this.
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Thursday, 08-May-2025 19:49:51 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     @thatbrickster@shitposter.world Yes, because it is literally illegal to release the modem sourcecode and modify it thanks to all the telecom agencies around the world.
     
     They are afraid someone will use this knowledge to make phone calls without paying or jam the network or something.

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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Thursday, 08-May-2025 19:53:55 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     @thatbrickster@shitposter.world I don't know if that really is a real problem or just corpo lies to prevent us from gaining freedom.
     
     But even if that was true that would mean that the cellphone network is very fundamentally flawed if it relied fully on client side locks to keep it from not destroying itself.

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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:25:47 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster It is not illegal to release modem source code and there is indeed a free software baseband GSM stack (OsmocomBB) and free software LTE implementations (of limited functionality).
     
     Instead, telecom agencies and the patent holders for the protocols will not permit a modem on any network they control unless its IMEI is registered in a big database and the modem contains proprietary malware that disobeys and spies on the user and of course no business is going to release the source code of their malware.
     
     >to make phone calls without paying
     Phone calls are really unrelated to LTE networks (as those just transmit IP packets) - the only way to make a phone call is to do SIP and RTP sessions (or a proprietary version of such protocols) through a phone upstream and those are designed to only permit calls from/to approved numbers and also are billed by the minute and therefore running free software on a mobile chipset won't allow you to make phone calls without paying.
     
     >or jam the network or something.
     All you need is a radio jammer on the LTE frequencies to jam the network, which can be easily bought online.
     
     Attacks against vulnerable LTE baseband implementations are possible, but all making everything proprietary does is slow down malicious attackers a little bit (who won't hesitate to use any illegal means possible to get up to speed), while ensuring that security researchers are slowed or stopped from finding vulnerabilities and responsibly disclosing them (with the end result being only negatives for security).
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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:29:06 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster >just corpo lies to prevent us from gaining freedom.
     It's always corpo lies.
     
     >if it relied fully on client side locks to keep it from not destroying itself.
     Previous mobile networks were dependent on devices trusted to perform correctly, but that is no longer the case.
     
     Current LTE networks are just an IPv6 network that sends packets, with everything important implemented server side.
     
     Even if you accessed a LTE network with only free software, the network is still designed to spy on your location and sell that.
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:32:24 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world Even if you accessed a LTE network with only free software, the network is still designed to spy on your location and sell that.That is a different problem from software freedom tho. Being able to access the network would still be a huge improvement as you would able to choose from which location you decide to connect from to not expose things you don't want to expose to them.

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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:34:16 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster Or you can just get a decent internet connection setup instead? (A fibre connection).
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:34:57 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world I use Telegram in the same way for example. The client is free software but the network probably spies on your messages so if I talk to people using Telegram I will not share any sensitive information that I wouldn't share on my public fediverse timeline either. If I wanted to share private information I would move the conversation to a more private protocol like XMPP.

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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:38:19 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world Sorry it's not possible to bring a decent fibre connected internet setup with me everywhere I go. Unlike you I leave the house sometimes.

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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:38:39 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster It is not possible to use Telegram and only run free software.
     
     You cannot download this client and use Telegram; https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.telegram.messenger/
     
     The only way you can sign up is via the proprietary software client that most likely contains proprietary malware, considering the "sources" releases can lag behind the binary releases by months and only then you can install a client from f-droid.
   • Embed this notice
     Zergling_man (zergling_man@sacred.harpy.faith)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:38:44 JST Zergling_man

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     @Suiseiseki @thatbrickster @SuperDicq Just lay your own fibre cables.
     翠星石 likes this.
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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:38:56 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Zergling_man
     @Zergling_man @SuperDicq @thatbrickster Yes, expand the GNUnet to the physical realm.
   • Embed this notice
     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:40:27 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster With a long enough fibre spool, it certainly is possible.
     
     It shouldn't matter if you don't have an internet connection for a few hours, otherwise something is very wrong.
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:41:49 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world The only way you can sign up is via the proprietary software client that most likely contains proprietary malwareI'm pretty sure you can also sign up with a free client. Including the desktop version and web based client. You don't even a need a phone, but you do need a phone number that is able to receive SMS messages for verification unfortunately.

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:43:26 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world Of course I'm saying Telegram is a good messenger or anything. Just saying that with some workarounds it is possible to use it in freedom.

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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:43:28 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster " *Warning:* Creating new accounts in the FOSS version not possible anymore, you have to create an account in the official build and then login to the FOSS."
     
     "Web clients" are proprietary software for everything but the host, even if all the JavaScript is under a free license.
     
     Electron garbage tends to be proprietary software every single time.
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:45:27 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world The Telegram desktop client does not use Electron, it uses QT. The desktop client is also from the official repositories available in most free GNU/Linux distributions such as GNU Guix, Trisquel and Parabola.

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     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:45:41 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • ロミンちゃん
     @romin @SuperDicq @thatbrickster How does one acquire such tokens without running proprietary software?
   • Embed this notice
     ロミンちゃん (romin@shitposter.world)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:45:42 JST ロミンちゃん

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     @Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @thatbrickster
     >The only way you can sign up is via the proprietary software
     false, you can get a telegram number using their scam blockchain
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:47:52 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • ロミンちゃん

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @romin@shitposter.world @thatbrickster@shitposter.world You don't but you can acquire an anonymous prepaid sim card to use as a phone number to sign up for paid with cash at any supermarket.

   • Embed this notice
     翠星石 (suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:48:01 JST 翠星石

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     @SuperDicq @thatbrickster Hmm, I must have misremembered.
     
     Is that a real desktop client, or does it rely on a demon rectangle?
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Friday, 09-May-2025 19:48:42 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石

     @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world It is a real desktop client written using QT. It does not share a codebase with the Android version.

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 00:25:25 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • GNU Tar

     @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world This is only true on Android

   • Embed this notice
     GNU Tar (freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 00:25:28 JST GNU Tar

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     @Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @thatbrickster
     As far as I know, the Telegram desktop client is free. However, if you want to create an account, someone will have to execute proprietary software.
     
     Correct me if I'm wrong.
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 02:35:55 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com Telegram has DRM?

   • Embed this notice
     𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙 (sally@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 02:35:58 JST 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • GNU Tar
     @SuperDicq @Suiseiseki @thatbrickster @freetar
     
     This is true nowhere. All clients have DRM and break freedom 0.
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 02:59:57 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com Maybe you should complain at distro maintainers of FSF endorsed distros that decided to include telegram-desktop then

   • Embed this notice
     𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙 (sally@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 02:59:58 JST 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • GNU Tar
     @SuperDicq @Suiseiseki @thatbrickster @freetar
     
     I've made a lengthy post about it many moons ago and I vaguely recall you were among the bottom-barrel retards that disagreed with it, I might be recalling wrong but knowing who you are I wouldn't be surprised either way.
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 09:12:58 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world Telegram isn't good but I find it the most acceptable as a normie messenger because the client is free. Better than Whatsapp and Signal at least which are more proprietary.
     
     I think the signup process of Telegram got changed. You used to be able to register an account without running the proprietary version of the app. Thankfully I already have an account but it sucks if you try to register today.

   • Embed this notice
     GNU Tar (freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 09:13:00 JST GNU Tar

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     @sally @SuperDicq @Suiseiseki @thatbrickster
     I recommend posting such information on the Trisquel Forum.
     
     On the other hand, I tried to create a Telegram account using the client provided by Trisquel, but I received a message that says: "Please enter the code that was sent to you via Telegram or log in via QR code. If you haven't signed up for Telegram yet, please register from your phone or tablet first".
     
     I also tried to register a Telegram account on LineageOS by downloading the official client from Aurora Store. However, when I reached the screen where I need to enter the code, it indicated that the code was sent to me via SMS, but it never arrived. I assume that Telegram does not allow account creation without Google Play Services, as I tried to register an account using the official client from the Play Store on an Android device, and the code just arrived via SMS.
     
     No GNU/Interjection required — I am aware of how proprietary all the mentioned software is, although I am not completely sure about Telegram.
     
     I would appreciate it if you could check whether this is just an unexpected error or if there is another underlying issue.
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 09:15:30 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • 👺防空識別區👹
     • GNU Tar

     @adiz@mtl.jinxian.casa @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com As a Chinese I definitely hope you don't use WeChat instead.

   • Embed this notice
     👺防空識別區👹 (adiz@mtl.jinxian.casa)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 09:15:31 JST 👺防空識別區👹

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @SuperDicq I've been banned from Telegram twice. And, Telegram won't accept my Chinese phone number for account registration. So, I have decided that I won't ever have a Telegram account again, I guess. @Suiseiseki @sally @thatbrickster @freetar

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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 09:19:18 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • 👺防空識別區👹
     • GNU Tar

     @adiz@mtl.jinxian.casa @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com Damn sucks to be you

   • Embed this notice
     👺防空識別區👹 (adiz@mtl.jinxian.casa)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 09:19:19 JST 👺防空識別區👹

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @SuperDicq I use WeChat for everything, of course. All my messaging IRL people and most of my payments, always WeChat. @Suiseiseki @sally @thatbrickster @freetar

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 18:29:52 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world My Telegram account is 13 years old so yes

   • Embed this notice
     GNU Tar (freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 18:29:53 JST GNU Tar

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     @SuperDicq @Suiseiseki @sally @thatbrickster
     Yes, I suppose you registered when it was still possible to do so from the free client.
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     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 18:33:07 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     • GNU Tar

     @freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com @sally@freesoftwareextremist.com @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @thatbrickster@shitposter.world Yes I agree that Telegram is free software that contains a bunch of anti features. Not great, but still technically free.

   • Embed this notice
     GNU Tar (freetar@freesoftwareextremist.com)'s status on Saturday, 10-May-2025 18:33:09 JST GNU Tar

     in reply to

     • 翠星石
     • SuperDicq
     • 𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙𝅙
     @sally @SuperDicq @Suiseiseki @thatbrickster
     Freedom 0 of free software guarantees users "the freedom to run the program as they wish, for any purpose". This does not mean all features must work without restrictions — but rather that the execution of the software on your computer is unrestricted.
     
     Telegram Desktop requires that, when building your own copy, you provide an api_id and api_hash. You can obtain "your own credentials" (which requires executing proprietary software) — not to forbid execution, but to authorize access to its API. However, Telegram provides public test credentials. If you use the public test credentials:
     
     api_id: 17349
     api_hash: 344583e45741c457fe1862106095a5eb
     
     the client can be compiled, executed, and its interface explored — but when attempting to log in, it will return an internal server error (API_ID_PUBLISHED_FLOOD). That limitation affects the usefulness of the login feature, not the freedom to execute the software.
     
     Disabling part of a software functionality does not infringe freedom 0 as long as the binary can be executed. And since Telegram Desktop is free software, freedoms 1 and 3 allow you to study, modify, and redistribute the software. If you find the credential requirement unacceptable, you are free to remove or alter that check in your version and share it freely:
     
     wget -qO- https://raw.githubusercontent.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/dev/Telegram/SourceFiles/config.h | sed -n "88p"
     
     Removing that #error allows you to compile without the preprocessor stopping you, but it does not elude the server verification – the client will continue to use the test credentials (17349/…5eb) and Telegram will reject the login with an internal server error.
     
     You would also need to replace those constants with valid credentials or modify the client to point to your own MTProto server – but all official clients have the RSA key of Telegram's server hardcoded so without that key, you will never be able to connect to your own server.
     
     In conclusion, the requirement of an api_id and api_hash limits access to the Telegram API — but it does not stop you from executing the software. Therefore, freedom 0 is not infringed — but perhaps this makes the exercise of freedoms 2 and 3 inconvenient.