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   Feart n Tired ??????? (feartntired@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 01:56:00 JST Feart n Tired ???????
   no-one can have a happy ending, ever. all things must be made darkness and suffering.
   
   https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dorothy-Must-Die-Danielle-Paige-ebook/dp/B00DB3D302/262-2907758-4113562
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 01:56:00 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     @FeartnTired This is actually a big complaint of mine these days.
     It seems like nothing can be wholesome or uplifting, everything has to be coarse, ugly, depressing and nasty. There can be no pure adventures and characters must have no redeeming qualities.

     It's very clearly justified by calling it "gritty" or "real", or perhaps even "complex". The idea obviously being stories like this are more "sophisticated" and things that aren't like this, are immature and kitchy.

     And everywhere, TV and films, that horrible blue filter that makes even the brightest, sunniest summer day look bleak and horrid.

     Can you tell I hate it?

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     Matron of the ninth circle (grumpyoldnurse@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 01:56:25 JST Matron of the ninth circle

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @Gnomeshatecheese @FeartnTired It's a shortcut for the intellectually lazy; like what everyone else hates, hate what they like, and people will mistake your contrariness for intelligence.
     
     Not to say I don't think there's merit in examining the darkness, or thinking about why literary villains do what they do (a well written antagonist isn't cartoonishly bad just because, after all) but making everything gritty and dire is just as intellectually childish as making everything default to Pollyanna.
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 01:56:36 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     @GrumpyOldNurse @FeartnTired

     ...but making everything gritty and dire...

     That's exactly my thinking. I don't mind there being "gritty dramas", even I might watch one once in a while. What I hate is that everything seemingly has to be made that way.
     Also, a proper story doesn't have to be either or. The best adventure stories and mysteries have moments of gritty, without being overwhelmed by it. That doesn't make them Pollyannish kids stories, as some people seem to think.

     It's a shortcut for the intellectually lazy; like what everyone else hates, hate what they like, and people will mistake your contrariness for intelligence.

     You might be right there. That would certainly explain it. I was just putting it down to a very irritating fashion.

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     Matron of the ninth circle (grumpyoldnurse@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:03 JST Matron of the ninth circle

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     • sim
     @sim @FeartnTired @Gnomeshatecheese And, that's fine if it's plausible.
     
     There's this weird stylistic choice these days, where all the books have to be dark and all the tv shows and movies have to be gritty and I'm tired of it.
     
     That's not to say no one should ever do a gritty show, but when they reframe the old Archie comics as gritty, it looks like they've lost the plot.
     
     The best tv comedies were ones that dealt with heavy subjects, like All In The Family or Barney Miller. Lots of social commentary, lots of humor too.
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:03 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • sim

     @GrumpyOldNurse @sim @FeartnTired And I for example don't mind a rough character with difficulties and flaws. But I want there to be something redeemable about them. Or that they develop into someone redeemable.

     A non-redeemable character that starts, stays and ends that way is just... utterly distasteful to me.

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     Matron of the ninth circle (grumpyoldnurse@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:04 JST Matron of the ninth circle

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     • sim
     @sim @FeartnTired @Gnomeshatecheese Exactly.
     
     Again, dark themes aren't the problem for me. I did, in fact, enjoy reading about the vampire's point of view. But, once or twice was clever. Endlessly gritty is just lazy.
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     sim@shitposter.world's status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:04 JST sim

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @GrumpyOldNurse @FeartnTired @Gnomeshatecheese Yeah. Although I have to admit that I do like a good ending that makes sense for my characters. They just go through a lot of suffering to get there.
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     Matron of the ninth circle (grumpyoldnurse@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:05 JST Matron of the ninth circle

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     • sim
     @sim @FeartnTired @Gnomeshatecheese Again, there's a difference between exploring dark themes and just acting like a whiny teenager wannabe emo who substitutes gritty for intelligence.
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     sim@shitposter.world's status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:05 JST sim

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @GrumpyOldNurse @FeartnTired @Gnomeshatecheese Yeah, the last one only works if you are portraying a character like that. But even then, I like to see the changes as the character learns and grows through the story. Too often this doesn't happen, or you end up glorifying these horrible things.
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     Feart n Tired ??????? (feartntired@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:06 JST Feart n Tired ???????

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @Gnomeshatecheese @GrumpyOldNurse we are all in agreement
     
     have something wholesome to make you feel better.
     
     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4OlL0OpbW8
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     sim@shitposter.world's status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:08:06 JST sim

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @FeartnTired @Gnomeshatecheese @GrumpyOldNurse I agree with you ladies so I apologise for continuing this trend in storytelling. Although I'm not sure where it stems from... but a part of it is the genre for me, a part of it is the characters themselves since they tell me what they've been through, that I like exploring darker sides to human nature but in a way that is more realistic and maybe my life is shit in general right now so I'm influenced by that. If I get sick of this enough, I'll try to change this too.
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     KeepTakingTheSoma (keeptakingthesoma@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 04:11:12 JST KeepTakingTheSoma

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     • sim
     @Gnomeshatecheese @GrumpyOldNurse @sim @FeartnTired I know what you mean. Well-rounded characters are more engaging. When I choose plays to direct for the drama group I like plays with characters that actors can find ways into.
     The only time I write utter villains is for pantomime or a murder mystery. My panto villains usually get a redemption arc through magic. My murder victims need to be so awful that people want them to die.
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Friday, 03-Jan-2025 07:44:52 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     • Matron of the ninth circle
     • KeepTakingTheSoma
     • sim

     @KeepTakingTheSoma @GrumpyOldNurse @sim @FeartnTired I don't even mind a completely nice character, like you'd get in old-school adventures. Those are fun. But the forever-non-redeemable ones are just nihilistic. And I don't do nihilism.

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