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   anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Saturday, 23-Nov-2024 13:08:36 JST anemone

   i still dont get why people on here are so racist. is it that hard for you to judge people based on their individual merits? seems like a form of mental retardation

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Saturday, 23-Nov-2024 13:08:35 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone
     
     > i still dont get why people on here are so racist.
     
     Because high ingroup preference ("agreeableness") exists and for some people, "us" is a race; increasingly, the "us" is political rather than racial or religious or regional.
     
     The really high agreeableness is also the reason people have difficulty with $ingroup having $outgroup trappings, so you have the nazzihs getting upset over a honkey that thinks they're retarded, etc.
     
     > is it that hard for you to judge people based on their individual merits?
     
     I forget the name of the guy that wrote the major book on sales (and I also haven't read the book), but one of the things he emphasized was likeability, as he observed (correctly) that people will make most decisions based on their emotions and then rationalize after the fact.
     
     > seems like a form of mental retardation
     
     You're not going to wipe out instinct and temperament by reasoning for the most part, and aside from that, you're reasoning from a different set of premises than they are. If you don't understand that and you think that your axioms are the only ones that are reasonable as a basis for your morality, then you will think they're stupid.
     
     Race is a heuristic; it's a bad heuristic but it is a heuristic, and this is the reason for the apparent contradiction: higher IQ people have a greater tendency towards racism. (Another potential explanation is that intelligence and heterodoxy are correlated and the orthodoxy is currently very anti-racist.)
     
     Counter-intuitively, racism is positively correlated with exposure to other cultures. Students that were sent to Mexico as part of their study of Spanish had lower opinions of Mexicans than the other group, which spent an equivalent time learning about Mexican culture. I suspect that this is a matter of temperament and that it just doesn't find expression until exposure to $outgroup occurs.
     
     So, you know, I think the evanglistic racists are annoying as shit and I don't agree with their worldview, but why *shouldn't* they be racist? Different set of premises. Some people (the Hitler-humpers) treat "race good" as an axiom.
     big5.gif
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     Fish of Rage (sun@shitposter.world)'s status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 09:48:48 JST Fish of Rage

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     @p @anemone do any of these studies check revealed preferences or just preferences they are willing to say to a researcher
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 09:48:49 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone
     
     > This claim contradicts all the research I have seen
     
     Then you may want to re-read the article you linked to, as it contains citations that show exactly this. Those aren't the ones I saw, but you can probably find a racism enjoyer that collects these things.
     
     Intelligence and temperament are not linked, ingroup preference is a matter of temperament. It would require an explation if racism (a form of ingroup preference) actually did disappear with bumps to IQ. Education on abstinence doesn't stop teenagers from fucking; why would it have an effect on racism? I'm out behind the office smoking, a coworker comes by and says "Can I bum a cancer stick?" He must know that cigarette smoke contains carcinogens or he wouldn't call them that. If he knew, why did he want a cigarette? Why was I smoking?
     
     People like to think that they are intelligent and that all intelligent people will come to the same conclusions and they don't think "What if these people have radically different values?" You have a predisposition: intelligence, risk-aversion, novelty-seeking, ingroup preference, these all appear to be heritable.
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 09:48:50 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org higher IQ people have a greater tendency towards racism.Source? This claim contradicts all the research I have seen (example: https://academic.oup.com/socpro/article/63/1/21/1846173)

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     :suihead: (sui@decayable.ink)'s status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 11:29:42 JST :suihead:

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     Lacking basics like pattern recognition isn't a common attribute of higher IQs
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 11:29:42 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • :suihead:
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @Sui @anemone @catgirlswaaag Yeah, it stands to reason that intelligent people would be better at rationalizing whatever they want to do.
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 11:29:43 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     @catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me @p@fsebugoutzone.org i have never seen evidence for it anyway. The actual scientific studies I've read show that racism is correlated with low IQ. idk what p is smoking

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     noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen: (catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me)'s status on Sunday, 24-Nov-2024 11:29:49 JST noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     @p @anemone IQ is a dumb metric to justify personal biases considering that IQ can change over time based on nutrition and material conditions in the same population for example. It is actually quite braindead to appeal to "temperament" and "instinct" as relevant, valid concepts, as if we were still living in some regressed primordial age. Maybe you truly believe that we do. To suggest that the racists' exposure to different culture and the racists' revulsion at said culture is anything other than a tell of his own self-righteous personality and superiority complex is laughable and betrays a lack of self-awareness. No, actually it is the racists' own issues, not other cultures causing the racist to be so. Life is better when you're respectful and non-condescending to people first, and if you don't like them then you don't have to ascribe it to a whole group of people and there's really no need to make a deal of it. Race isn't a heuristic unless you're a racist. It is a faulty, myopic (and retarded) mentality which postures itself and seeks justification for its own assumptions. By the way, "smart" people can be very stupid in areas which they are not educated or lack understanding. Dunno if you were aware of that.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:17 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @anemone @catgirlswaaag
     
     > idk what p is smoking
     
     You really ought to read the paper you linked to before you tell me I'm hallucinating:
     
     > The “ideological refinement perspective,” by contrast, contends that cognitively sophisticated members of a dominant racial group are no more committed to racial equality than their peers with lower ability (Jackman 1978, 1981, 1994; Jackman and Muha 1984).
     
     I haven't read those papers, it's a different one that I saw, but if you're going to say a study doesn't exist, at least avoid citing something that mentions its existence in the second paragraph. You can say they're incorrect, but you really can't say that they don't exist.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:41 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @catgirlswaaag @anemone
     
     > free speech is bullshit when it goes from personal expression or a valid critique of the government to being used to punch-down and cynically justify shitty braindead beliefs and use them as a verbal bludgeon against those deemed as other. (and those they see as lesser than them)
     
     Who decides what is a valid critique?
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:43 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     @catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me @p@fsebugoutzone.org the "free speech extremist" thing is just a grift, then? sad

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     noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen: (catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:43 JST noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     @anemone @p free speech is bullshit when it goes from personal expression or a valid critique of the government to being used to punch-down and cynically justify shitty braindead beliefs and use them as a verbal bludgeon against those deemed as other. (and those they see as lesser than them)
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     noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen: (catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:44 JST noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     @anemone @p yeah its just lipservice to racists and nazis that hang out on his platform lol
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:47 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone
     
     > no response... curious
     
     I haven't been at my desk; I don't recall signing an SLA, anyway.
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:11:48 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org no response... curious

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:04 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone The main point was that there is a genetic component to temperament, and in addition to that, you have upbringing and you have culture. Racism and anti-racism are essentially ethical/emotional issues and you don't make any headway in either direction without addressing the premise and talking to people in their own terms.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:05 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone If you say so; I thought you were interested in the topic rather than circle-jerking until I saw your "DEBATE ME BRO" post and I'm opting out. I can point you to people that are happy to argue in favor of racism if you like. In fact, a good place to start would be nice crew dot digital, which has instance-blocked FSE, and Poast's blockbot, which is public: https://poa.st/@madonline . Most of those are people that are so invested in the pro-racism internet arguments that I had to put a bot to them to get them to leave me alone.
     blockbot.png
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:05 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org i am i willing to have a conversation i just don't think a couple anecdotes are that interesting or convincing

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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:06 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org you're conflating broad trends with individual anecdotes

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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:13 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org I still maintain that, on average, the sincere racist is a dumbass

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:13 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone Well, sure, but the median human is a dumbass; nothing for it. It used to be legal to sterilize criminals and the mentally disabled, and I think that's worse than just living in a world with dumbasses in it. You can't cure racism, you can't cure dumbass, the best you can hope for is to make sure that it's more trouble than it's worth to interfere with what you're doing.
     
     :mugabeshades: This is a popular approach even for people that run countries. :kimjongilshades:
     
     :khaddafiwat: (:ddr_l: Although some people learned this lesson the hard way.)
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:14 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org "i can point to a smart person who's racist" does not mean that racism isn't more broadly correlated with lower intelligence or reasoning ability. Also people can be racist for different reasons. Some people profess racist views because they think appealing to racists grants them benefits (see: dark enlightenment type people)

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:17 JST pistolero

     in reply to
     @anemone
     
     > "i can point to a smart person who's racist"
     
     I did not say this. Anyone can do that. I did say that you can empirically verify akrasia. I do not want to have a stupid internet argument.
     
     > (see: dark enlightenment type people)
     
     I don't know who counts as "Dark Enlightenment" but I don't need to because I'm sure there are plenty of race-hustlers, same as with any cause people might take up.
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     w0rm (w0rm@ryona.agency)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:17 JST w0rm

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     @p @anemone
     
     This why I make sure to season my corn starch. (Pattern matching is magical tricknology to the negro.)
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:13:59 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • :suihead:
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @catgirlswaaag @Sui @anemone
     
     > what you think is pattern recognition is just confirmation bias through the media u consume
     cvcvcv-was-right.png
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     noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen: (catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:00 JST noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     in reply to

     • :suihead:
     • pistolero
     @Sui @anemone @p Pattern recognition isn't what your tiny retard brain thinks it is, because you're not a true skitzo or on any sorta level with anyone actually intelligent. what you think is pattern recognition is just confirmation bias through the media u consume and your own inherent racism. ur just a proud retard larping as edgy asshole smart guy and its pretty fucking lame and gay lol
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:05 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • Selene of Troy
     • :suihead:
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @catgirlswaaag @Sui @anemone You're like the inverse of @daughterofgia and maybe if you both go into the same thread, you'll both disappear and emit two gamma photons.
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     :suihead: (sui@decayable.ink)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:07 JST :suihead:

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     Under a sentence in and you're already relying on ad hominems, I'm clearly dealing with a genius so I'll just stop reading there.
     
     Kys and help improve the average IQ kthx lol.
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     noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen: (catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:07 JST noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     in reply to

     • :suihead:
     • pistolero
     @Sui @anemone @p womp womp, go cry about it bitch. you won't do shit.
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:49 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • :suihead:
     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org @catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me @Sui@decayable.ink Failed to load resource: the server responded with a status of 451

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:49 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • :suihead:
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @anemone @Sui @catgirlswaaag That only happens if you use Cloudfed to fetch the image. You should switch to Tor, doesn't publish a geofeed CSV: https://api.cloudflare.com/local-ip-ranges.csv .
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:57 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • lks
     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     @lks@poa.st @catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me @p@fsebugoutzone.org you can't even spell dumbass

     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: repeated this.
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:57 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • lks
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @anemone @catgirlswaaag @lks That is like saying "how is babby formed" is spelled wrong.
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     lks (lks@poa.st)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:14:58 JST lks

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @catgirlswaaag @anemone @p
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:15:15 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • lks
     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     @p@fsebugoutzone.org @catgirlswaaag@social.xenofem.me @lks@poa.st it's spelled "baby" you fucking retard

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:15:15 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • lks
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @anemone @catgirlswaaag @lks how girl get pragnent
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     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 12:15:52 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to

     • lks
     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @p @anemone @lks @catgirlswaaag
     shut_it_down_irish.jpg
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:02:25 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     • lks
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @dcc @anemone @catgirlswaaag @lks Faith and begorrah!
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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:33:14 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • Paradox
     @Paradox
     
     > Intent.
     
     This is why I keep asking who decides. It's obvious what's a good way to have a conversation and what isn't, but you try to actually implement it and you get a lot of problems. It is difficult to construct rules that achieve what you are trying to achieve, and even harder to make rules that people will understand (so that a person can tell in advance whether what they are doing violates those rules, and so that whoever is charged with applying them can actually do so, and so that others can review those decisions). Then you have who is actually in charge of deciding. If it was easy, if it was clear-cut, it could be handed to a machine and we could ignore it, but it's not easy.
     
     > You can satirize something and show how to improve it, or you can just dunk on it ad nauseam.
     
     There's no objective set of rules that can distinguish the two cases.
     tupac_ft._trick_daddy--still_ballin.mp3
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     Paradox (paradox@raru.re)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:33:16 JST Paradox

     in reply to

     • pistolero

     @p
     Intent. "Just asking questions" tends to be a baited bad faith argument. Instead of asking questions to understand the topic and seek to provide constructive criticism, they ask leading questions based on their conceptions, deceptively worded to trap the responder with answers that sound bad without context.
     As for sarcasm and facetious comments, those can go either way. You can satirize something and show how to improve it, or you can just dunk on it ad nauseam.

     Admittedly that's not a super clear cut metric, but you can suss out most of it with critical thought.

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:33:17 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • Paradox
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @Paradox @anemone @catgirlswaaag Well, who decides what constitutes one rather than the other? And how do you handle sarcasm, facetious questions, or the case of, e.g., the Holocaust-guy or KiwiFarms lolcow-tipper that is "just asking questions"?
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     Paradox (paradox@raru.re)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:33:18 JST Paradox

     in reply to

     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     @p @anemone @catgirlswaaag
     Constructive criticism vs destructive criticism.
     "Here's how we can maybe make this better" vs "I hate you, piss off, spawn of Satan".

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     pistolero (p@fsebugoutzone.org)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:33:31 JST pistolero

     in reply to

     • ĐØⱠⱠ
     • lks
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:
     @Doll @anemone @lks @catgirlswaaag
     weegee.jpg
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     ĐØⱠⱠ (doll@decayable.ink)'s status on Monday, 25-Nov-2024 13:33:32 JST ĐØⱠⱠ

     in reply to

     • lks
     • pistolero
     • noxious weed bunny :labrys-45-estrogen:

     They use a Luigi board.