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1. Embed this notice
   goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 19:08:30 JST goatsarah

   Techbros: self driving cars are inevitable!

   Also techbros: prove you are human by performing a task that computers can’t do, like identifying traffic lights.

   • kaia likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 19:52:41 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius

     @robcornelius I’m fully aware. I’m also aware that they are STILL doing both, simultaneously. Only one can be true. Which is it?

     (Hint, it’s “computers can’t identify traffic lights”. Self driving cars are, in fact, randomised murderbots)

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     RobCornelius (robcornelius@climatejustice.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 19:52:43 JST RobCornelius

     in reply to

     @goatsarah

     Why do you think the tech bros want us to identify traffic lights, bicycles etc. Its so they can better train their "AI" models to spot them so the self driving cars become a reality. We are all beta testers

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 20:04:23 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius
     @robcornelius notice, BTW, it’s always American street furniture, a country well known for being a huge international outlier in terms of not using internationally standardised vernacular for street furniture.
   • Embed this notice
     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 20:21:46 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius
     @robcornelius Or anywhere that’s not North America, with its own “not invented here” take on how streetscapes should look.
   • Embed this notice
     RobCornelius (robcornelius@climatejustice.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 20:21:48 JST RobCornelius

     in reply to

     @goatsarah

     Its down to certain peoples egos (specifically Muskrats) versus reality. Its not going to end well, that's for sure.

     Have you ever noticed you are never asked to identify street objects in upscale neighbourhoods? OK posh neighbourhoods are less cluttered but....

   • Embed this notice
     Kote Isaev (koteisaev@mastodon.online)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 21:55:48 JST Kote Isaev

     in reply to

     @goatsarah The great plan:
     1️⃣ Give techbros all your data for free
     2️⃣ spend your meaningless life watching boring and annoying ads all time, even while farting at WC, giving techbros bucks in the process.
     2️⃣ Help techbros to train visual AI via captchas
     3️⃣ be smashed in an driving incident by a self-driving car.
     4️⃣ PROFIT!

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     MostlyTato (mostlytato@mstdn.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 22:02:02 JST MostlyTato

     in reply to

     @goatsarah
     I wonder if this means that if you spend hours intentionally providing the wrong answers round and round in circles, that it will serve to confuse AI learning somewhat 🤔

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   • Embed this notice
     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 23:46:24 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius
     • Bornach

     @bornach @robcornelius Except that's nothing like the widely internationally ratified sign for a traffic light, as used in most of the world (completely the wrong shape for a start!)

     en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vienna_C…

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     Bornach (bornach@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 23:46:25 JST Bornach

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius

     @goatsarah @robcornelius

     Perhaps it is because the self-driving AI's already know what objects are unambiguously traffic lights but still require human input to answer the philosophical questions of whether the iconic depiction of a traffic light painted on a sign counts as a traffic light

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 00:00:29 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Ádám :fedora: 🇭🇺

     @adam Ok, 2 problems: 1. American roads. The US has not signed up to the Vienna Convention on traffic signs which most of the rest of the world uses.

     2. Those cars are out there today, so if they still need training to recognise things that they aren't supposed to run into, then they're basically murderbots.

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     Ádám :fedora: 🇭🇺 (adam@fedi.rusadam.hu)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 00:00:31 JST Ádám :fedora: 🇭🇺

     in reply to

     @goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org iirc that's the exact reason why captchas include things that can be encountered on roads, to help the AI recognize them.

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 00:36:59 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Anton Podolsky

     @antonpodolsky That's what they're doing.

     As a result, they will get very good at spotting things that look like American traffic lights used in Captchas, and probably dreadful at spotting anything else.

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     Anton Podolsky (antonpodolsky@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 00:37:00 JST Anton Podolsky

     in reply to

     @goatsarah If I was a techbro I would totally use the data collected from captchas to train AI models.

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     Ádám :fedora: 🇭🇺 (adam@fedi.rusadam.hu)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 02:07:36 JST Ádám :fedora: 🇭🇺

     in reply to

     @goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org I didn't want to imply that I support self-driving cars. I think it's a terrible idea. And in its current form it actually does more harm than good.

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   • Embed this notice
     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 02:14:26 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius
     • Carlos Guerreiro
     @carlos @robcornelius The tailgating. Oh. My. God.
   • Embed this notice
     Carlos Guerreiro (carlos@social.perceptiveconstructs.com)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 02:14:29 JST Carlos Guerreiro

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius
     @goatsarah @robcornelius
     
     Self-driving cars are for sure not ready yet, and some companies and people are pushing their deployment too hard.
     
     I'm convinced they will get good enough though.
     
     On a related note, I saw in your profile you moved to Portugal. I hope you like it there, and there is indeed much to like, but you must have noticed how *people* drive over there. It shows up in the accident and death stats too.
     I'm Portuguese and grew up there. I'm not at all convinced that people can drive safely.
   • Embed this notice
     Robert Kingett backup (weirdwriter@tweesecake.social)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 11:30:30 JST Robert Kingett backup

     in reply to

     @goatsarah You just described my trepidations over this forever now! This is just pure gold

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 11:47:56 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • ajlanes
     • RobCornelius
     @ajlanes @robcornelius Their road signs are utterly unlike anyone else's, because fuck us, that's why.
   • Embed this notice
     ajlanes (ajlanes@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 11:47:58 JST ajlanes

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius
     @goatsarah @robcornelius I had no idea (but am unsurprised) that the US is not a signatory to the Vienna Convention. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vienna_C…
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     Jim Schoch (opa@mstdn.party)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 21:27:13 JST Jim Schoch

     in reply to

     @goatsarah actually Teslas can identify traffic lights.

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Sep-2023 21:27:13 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Jim Schoch
     @Opa Thanks Reply Guy!
   • Embed this notice
     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 00:48:18 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Andreas K
     • Marty Fouts
     • RobCornelius
     @MartyFouts @yacc143 @robcornelius why, it’s almost like there’s a whole pile of bullshit surrounding the whole endeavour. So unlike the tech industry, that.
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     Andreas K (yacc143@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 00:48:19 JST Andreas K

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius

     @goatsarah @robcornelius
     But coming back to the more general problem, and taking the point of view of a budding data scientist.

     It's not a question if algorithm-driven cars cause accidents. (the AI buzzword gives me migraine)

     Humans DO cause accidents too.

     So the question is: Do computer-driven cars cause more or less accidents than humans.

     It's hard to assess this, at the moment, as there are literally only a tiny number of really self-driving cars.

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     Marty Fouts (martyfouts@mastodon.online)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 00:48:19 JST Marty Fouts

     in reply to

     • Andreas K
     • RobCornelius

     @yacc143 @goatsarah @robcornelius There are roughly 70 companies researching driving automation here in the Bay Area that provide data to the state. Safety of these vehicles peaked around 3 years ago with the best performing cars having 5 times as many accidents per mile as the average driver. They appear to have reached the asymptote of the improvement curve.

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     Andreas K (yacc143@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 00:48:20 JST Andreas K

     in reply to

     • RobCornelius

     @goatsarah @robcornelius
     In the context of the trolley problem, they literally must be.

     (As are BTW humans, generally speaking, when an accident happens, humans do not have the time to take a well reasoned decision, it generally is more or less a random decision if at all.)

     Taking any stand on the trolley problem, and related ones, immediately raises questions of liability. So random() is the "safe" out for moral cowards.

   • Embed this notice
     RobCornelius (robcornelius@climatejustice.rocks)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 01:09:22 JST RobCornelius

     in reply to

     • Andreas K
     • Marty Fouts

     @yacc143 @MartyFouts @goatsarah

     Money

     Next Question.

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   • Embed this notice
     Andreas K (yacc143@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 01:09:23 JST Andreas K

     in reply to

     • Marty Fouts
     • RobCornelius

     @MartyFouts
     That begs the question how come they got the permission to test on public roads and endanger the public of that's their best case?
     @goatsarah @robcornelius

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 01:28:54 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Andreas K
     • Marty Fouts
     • RobCornelius
     @yacc143 @robcornelius @MartyFouts My car has a similar autopilot system (lane following and distance maintenance). It works very well, but you HAVE to be aware of its limitations. You CANNOT remove the human from the system
   • Embed this notice
     Andreas K (yacc143@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 01:28:55 JST Andreas K

     in reply to

     • Marty Fouts
     • RobCornelius

     @MartyFouts
     Don't take it wrongly, but the German car makers literally spent years in R&D and ended up offering way less (co pilot system for limited use cases eg high ways/autobahns), literally citing this as the safe state of the art. They could offer more of they were willing to associate their brands with unsafe cars.

     @goatsarah @robcornelius

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 08:01:56 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Andreas K
     • ajlanes
     @ajlanes @yacc143 oh, multiple times.
   • Embed this notice
     ajlanes (ajlanes@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Thursday, 07-Sep-2023 08:01:58 JST ajlanes

     in reply to

     • Andreas K
     @goatsarah @yacc143 Didn’t it try to kill you once?
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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Saturday, 09-Sep-2023 05:10:33 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Erik Andersen
     @girander Sounds like a really dystopian space for humans.
   • Embed this notice
     Erik Andersen (girander@masto.ai)'s status on Saturday, 09-Sep-2023 05:10:34 JST Erik Andersen

     in reply to

     @goatsarah at intersections automated vehicles continue in between crossing traffic without stopping, all vehicles being aware of the others and keeping necessary distance. No lights needed.

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     Patrice Mascalchi (pmascalchi@mas.to)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 16:52:35 JST Patrice Mascalchi

     in reply to

     @goatsarah Nice joke!! I actually learned recently why captcha or recaptcha got so simple, it's because it's not the result that matters 😂 It's the mouse path 🐁

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 16:52:35 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Patrice Mascalchi
     @pmascalchi Something something iPad something
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     Christian Gudrian (cgudrian@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 23:17:36 JST Christian Gudrian

     in reply to

     @goatsarah Whenever I encounter a captcha like that I imagine there’s somewhere just in this very moment a poor little self driving car needing my assistance.

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 23:31:33 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Stephan Schulz
     @StephanSchulz I wrote the software that built the chip that powers your phone. Sit down.
   • Embed this notice
     Stephan Schulz (stephanschulz@fosstodon.org)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 23:31:34 JST Stephan Schulz

     in reply to

     @goatsarah Why do you think "techbros" are a homogenous amorphous mass with a single will? Do you even have a working definition of what a "techbro" is? This sounds like classical prejudice to me - invent a group, then ascribe all opinions by one member to the group as a whole.

   • Embed this notice
     Stephan Schulz (stephanschulz@fosstodon.org)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 23:54:12 JST Stephan Schulz

     in reply to

     @goatsarah Trying to pull seniority on someone you don't know is not really a power move. Nor does it advance the discussion.

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     goatsarah (goatsarah@thegoatery.dyndns.org)'s status on Saturday, 23-Sep-2023 23:54:12 JST goatsarah

     in reply to

     • Stephan Schulz

     @StephanSchulz "Nor does it advance the discussion", he said, nasally.

     Nice fedora. Did your mum get it for you?

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     Nick Morgan (skilldrick@macaw.social)'s status on Sunday, 24-Sep-2023 03:03:01 JST Nick Morgan

     in reply to

     @goatsarah With enough people solving captchas constantly we'll be able to use them to help cars solve ethical problems on the fly like should I swerve to avoid the small child and hit the old lady

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