Chris Trottier
The re-brand of the Fediverse as "Mastodon" has created big problems -- problems that were both predictable and preventable.
For one thing, the honeymoon period for Mastodon is over.
People aren't willing to ignore its flaws anymore because it's the one alternative to Twitter that has traction.
Now people want creature comforts.
But guess what? Because the entirety of the Fediverse is branded as "Mastodon", people are more likely to migrate to Bluesky than elsewhere on the Fediverse.
Chris Trottier
To be sure, I'm trying to do my part by hosting servers that are an alternative to Mastodon, and banging the drum about the rest of the Fediverse.
But the stats don't lie.
Once people arrive to Mastodon, they're unlikely to try the rest of the Fediverse because Mastodon does a bad job letting people know that the Fediverse is bigger than Mastodon.
So what happens when Mastodon experiences detraction?
People simply leave the Fediverse.
Chris Trottier
I know a lot of you like Mastodon, and I'm not telling you to *not* like it.
What I'm saying is that no platform can be all things to all people, especially with functionality that's as purposely limited as Mastodon.
So instead of making people feel bad because they can't do what they want on Mastodon, it's an altogether *better* idea to recommend another Fediverse service.
Chris Trottier
@uc It's not dumb at all. We should achieve decentralization, make this war between protocols meaningless.
Ben ✌️
@atomicpoet I appreciate your drum banging. I tried Calckey and it’s so much more engaging. Idk enough about Bluesky’s protocol but I plan on making a library (typescript) that can translate between protocols. Maybe that sounds dumb, but even within ActivityPub there are already competing sub-standards.
Chris Trottier
@Sbectol It's true, the majority of growth for Misskey is in Japan.
I think Calckey can grow the *key apps in the West.
Sbectol :twt:
@atomicpoet it's only my opinion, but I suspect many westerners leave because they've been conditioned to believe something about *clout* on Facebook/twitter/insta
personal branding doesn't really work in federated social networks. So they migrate back to the places where these dreams are sold
I think the majority of the growth in the *keys services is non-western. Maybe I'm wrong in that.
Tucker Teague
@atomicpoet I used to be on a BBS, then I was on Myspace, then I was on Blogger, then Wordpress, then Facebook, then back to Wordpress, then Instagram, then Twitter, and now Mastodon. I still sometimes blog and I only follow family on Instagram. We all have different likes and needs & they change over time. I love Mastodon today & I'm not looking to move, but if something better comes along or my needs change then I might jump. It's really not that big of a deal if someone doesn't like it here.
💠 Dave No One 💠
@atomicpoet
Mastodon became popular with the Twitter Exodus. I am here for 5 years now, but used it only rarely when it was a cosy little nerd community.
I thinks the different #Fediverse services should try to target people to leave the commercial networks and join the corresponding #Fediverse services, like:
Twitter => #Mastodon
Facebook => #Diaspora (is this still a thing?)
Instagram => #Pixelfed
Each of them is different, but all of them become more interesting when more people are on them
Chris Trottier
@Rob How does Calckey distinguish itself on Mastodon when Mastodon users can't even easily see what kind of software a message originates on?
Rob Adamson
@atomicpoet Hi Chris. Been following you a while and really like your updates esp as a newbie to the Fediverse. Clearly last couple of days you’ve been posting away on this topic because it’s important. However, Mastodon being mistaken as the entirety of Fediverse is as much the fault of the other parts not distinguishing/differentiating themselves as Mastodon’s for not being to a fault noting it. It’s also not Mastodon’s fault they were in the right place when Musk imploded Twitter!
Саша Морс, here we go again...
@atomicpoet what rebranding? Where? How even?
Most people don't know what fediverse means, true. Even people that have been using Mastodon or other activitypub based things.
Are you suggesting there should be a starting point, an education initiative? That sounds great, where does it live, how do people get started?
Chris Trottier
@mastodonmigration FYI, the edit feature is in beta on one server (blahaj.zone), and it will make its way onto all servers very soon.
This isn't a matter of waiting months for editing. It's imminent.
Mastodon Migration
@atomicpoet It is not too late. Educating people takes time. #Bluesky is the new shiny object. It has the advantage that they can sell future promises while the Fediverse has put up. But soon enough reality will bite and that will come down to earth.
To move beyond Mastodon the Fediverse needs a killer alternative application. Calckey is very cool, but honestly it is still a little rough, and has no edit capability (...yet), which has become a "must have" feature IMO.
Chris Trottier
@dans_root Sadly, Diaspora is barely alive. The reason is that it hasn't adopted ActivityPub.
Chris Trottier
@alexmorse There's been a big movement to "Spread Mastodon".
Not spread the Fediverse. Spread Mastodon.
Саша Морс, here we go again...
@atomicpoet where?
I think that's a good idea.
There should be a spread fediverse movement too! Where's that one?
💠 Dave No One 💠
@atomicpoet
Oh, ok. That’s sad. I had an account there, too in 2018, but there wasn’t too much going on. I was primarily looking for some kind of privacy friendly social network at that time.
Саша Морс, here we go again...
@atomicpoet are there ads on twitter or bluesky or facebook or insta? Is this grass roots peer pressure?
Chris Trottier
@alexmorse All I'm going to say is that there's a campaign coming. I'm not "against" it. But I think there will be problems if people keep ignoring the rest of the Fediverse.
Саша Морс, here we go again...
@atomicpoet I dig promoting all sorts of fediverse. I'd put time into it. If you've got an idea, or a mailinglist or something sign me up.
Shoq
@atomicpoet I think the entire fediverse project needs to be reframed to get people out of this mindset that we're trying to build another Twitter. I don't much care if the masses ever care for the Fediverse. In fact, I'd be thrilled if they stayed away. I think we need social media that serves the people who care. About anything. If that sounds a bit elitist, well, perhaps it is. But so what? Is there some law that says we have to pretend everyone's voice has similar value? Spoiler. They don't.
Grassroots Joe
@atomicpoet
How about referring to the kinds of other Fediverse options that provide additional capabilities as "Mastodon+"?
"Regular Mastodon may not have all the bells and whistles that you want, but Mastodon+ does!"
Chris Trottier
@joeinwynnewood I found your question intriguing enough to ask everyone about it.
I wonder how Mastodon gGmbh would feel about that.
Grassroots Joe
@atomicpoet
There's nothing that says "we" can't just start to use the term when responding to people expressing frustration with regular Mastodon.
"If you would like to be able to RT, you can, you just have to get an account on a Mastodon+ server, they're part of the Fediverse too."
rtswiz
@atomicpoet wouldn’t the average person get overwhelmed by options and leave anyway?
Chris Trottier
@rtswiz I don't understand this mentality. The average person visits multiple websites every day. They register to multiple services.
rtswiz
@atomicpoet okay maybe I’m an outlier but most of my family would absolutely be confused by it, at least until after they’re onboarded and familiarized. They use email because they don’t have to think about it and it’s trivial to find a provider.
I guess the current policy with mostodon does hurt discoverability even more but I think making it easier to find those other services and communities would make a bigger difference than changing the signup flow specifically.
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