Notices by Jzero (guerillaontologist@social.coop), page 4

@ntnsndr @yala @skyfaller @shauna @Matt_Noyes

-Well we've somehow managed thus far without any need for crypto, right? MyCoolClass has members all over the world without need of crypto, so I think we're already enabled (without paying gas fees).

-This sounds like a legal risk to me, ex an SEC ruling.

-You can do this with permissioned blockchains that do not share the flaws of permissionless blockchains, and are tens of thousands of times cheaper to run. (https://blog.dshr.org/2023/02/economic-incentives.html)

@yala @ntnsndr @skyfaller @shauna @Matt_Noyes

Another critique that hasn't even been addressed in this thread is that tech solutions favor the tech savvy and put everyone else at a disadvantage. While anyone who can read can, with a little effort, understand a set of bylaws, in order to read a smart contract you have to learn to code. Again, no one has actually ever addressed this point.

https://geo.coop/blog/blockchain-no-place-build-co-op

@yala @ntnsndr @skyfaller @shauna @Matt_Noyes
I'd start with just one question, to keep it simple:

Given that blockchains, in practice, are not distributed or trustless systems, and given that anything you can do with a DAO you can accomplish in other ways, what is the argument for using crypto blockchains?

@shauna @Matt_Noyes @ntnsndr @Stacco @alannairving @mattcropp
Bingo. This is also a criticism of a lot of the "platform co-op" space - they focus on the tech too much and the cooperative culture aspects (almost) not at all.

@ntnsndr @skyfaller @shauna @Matt_Noyes @Stacco
Like, it would be super cool to one day actually have someone prove their contention that blockchains are decentralized. Decentralization may be great and all, but the blockchains aren't decentralized, so...

https://blog.dshr.org/2023/11/decentralized-finance-isnt.html

https://blog.dshr.org/2023/02/economic-incentives.html

https://blog.dshr.org/2022/01/another-layer-of-centralization.html

@ntnsndr @skyfaller @shauna @Matt_Noyes
Maybe someday we'll all be able to see the good side of MLMs too. It's a real shame that people are so down on them, just because they aren't perfect.

Seriously though, critiques of blockchain technology get met with philosophical arguments about the nature of money and claims about the technology that don't stand up to scrutiny. What I don't seem to get is specific responses to specific critiques.

@ntnsndr @skyfaller @shauna @Matt_Noyes
Maybe I could agree somewhat if blockchains were what they claim to be (and what you claim them to be), i.e. decentralized, anonymous, immutable. But in practice they are none of those things, which you must be aware of, right?

"the common meaning of ‘decentralized’ as applied to blockchain systems functions as a veil that covers over and prevents many from seeing the actions of key actors within the system." ~Prof. Angela Walch

@ntnsndr @shauna @Matt_Noyes @Stacco @alannairving @mattcropp
I've talked to a lot of people making co-ops irl, and the major issues they talk about nearly all revolve around building trust and relationships in one way or another. I don't think I've talked to anyone, actually, who's told me their major issue in starting a co-op was finding money.

@ntnsndr @edsu
Equating "using money and signing contracts" with getting into crypto is another wild statement. I don't even know how to respond to that. It's like saying "you already buy movie tickets, so I don't understand your problem with buying lottery tickets."

@ntnsndr This is the wildest statement I've read in awhile:

"why is it okay to sell shares of co-op stock backed by cops with guns but not digital tokens backed by cryptographic software?"

I think a lot of co-ops would be surprised to find that cops with guns have anything to do with their member recruitment.

@ntnsndr @edsu
My brother in Christ, your crypto tokens are also backed by state issued money. Why do you think the price of ETH is reported in dollars?

@ntnsndr My lengthy response to your lengthy response is now posted.

@ntnsndr How to install Linux, Firefox, UBlock Origin, and a VPN.

@ntnsndr fair enough...and boy oh boy do I not envy you having to try to navigate this stuff...

@ntnsndr Don't you think that begs the question of what higher ed is even for? If you can graduate without having to write anything longer than a ChapGPT prompt, well...we're doomed. And do you really want to be reading a bunch of AI generated text and then grading the student on how well the AI wrote? Again, what is the point of a university if it's just students using AI to write papers (perhaps followed by profs using AI to grade them)?

@ntnsndr So your students don't need to do their own writing anymore?

@ntnsndr dibs on taut.ology

@scribe
There needs to be some kind of negation process to hash out standard English spellings. Like, "We'll give you 'colour' and you give us 'labor.' We'll concede 'tyre' if you'll agree to 'enroll'."

TIL that the British spell "enrollment" with only one "l". Clearly, there is something wrong with these people.

@ntnsndr Have you read Hubert Horan's series on Uber's financials on Naked Capitalism? He doesn't think ridesharing has a business case even without outsized executive salaries. The Driver's Co-op is now shifting focus away from on-demand ride-sharing to paratransit, I imagine for all the reasons Horan details.