@dalias@emma@falcennial I think we're getting hung up on the definition of the first L in LLM. Which is fine. I'll concede that it may not be possible to create LLMs like more recent Claude or GPT models without mass data theft, and because of that, they simply shouldn't exist.
@dalias@falcennial You are right that just because a work is public on the internet, doesn't mean it can be used in any way for any result. So scratch that. However saying it's impossible to create a model without theft is also false, here's an example where it's been done: https://www.wired.com/story/proof-you-can-train-ai-without-slurping-copyrighted-content/. You can probably shift the goalposts and say, no "general use LLM," but again there nothing inherant about the technology that FORCES theft. Yeah, it's a lot easier to create an LLM if you do steal data. It would also be a lot easier for me to be a multi-millionaire if I robbed banks on the regular.
@dalias@falcennial Older works that have expired copyrights and publicly shared text on the internet are for the most part free game whether we like it or not. If you're claiming that this material is not enough to train even the least powerful LLMs, then yeah, they shouldn't exist.
@dalias@falcennial Are you claiming companies that are literally raising trillions of dollars can't afford to pay publishers for rights to use material for training?
@falcennial Hostile... But, a large language model doesn't have to be trained on stolen works of art. A LLM doesn't have to used as an excuse to abuse the labor force. A LLM doesn't have to be used as a data surveillance vector. LLM companies don't have to constantly train more complex models using up huge amounts of energy and water. LLMs don't have to be used to target human beings in war. LLMs don't have to be used to poison the commons data-space. All of these things are choices wealthy, powerful people have made. These are choices.
I've worked in tech for over 20 years, and I've never been threatened for not using particular tools until this year. I think that says a lot about where we are.
@mjdxp@FknHannu For real, when I first started in IT, the company I worked for hosted their own IRC and Jabber servers, my laptop was a Dell tank running Debian, no corpospyware, I could chat with everyone I knew using Pidgin. It was glorious.
@evan I'd say it depends. If we're talking about vibe coded slop, no. An LLM used for accessibility reasons, yes. Does it humanize or dehumanize, that is the question.
"If you don't start using AI you're going to be left behind."
Nope, we're going to leave your ass behind. We'll keep automating with testable, repeatable, infrastructure-as-code. Our repos will be well documented by engineers, well organized, and easy to understand. We'll keep honing our skills while you generate copious slop. Oh, and take your poorly veiled threat and and shove it way back up your ass where it belongs. </rant>
Device hoarding, quiet quitting Luddite. Do less. You're already enough. Take a nap. Required to participate in late stage capitalism, but highly critical. My toots auto-delete after two weeks.#noindex #nobot #noaiAll photos posted are my own, no AI generated slop, no theft.Profile Photo: Middle aged white dude with close beard and greying hair.Header Photo: The April 2024 Total eclipse. Taken from my backyard.