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   ANNA is UTOPIA!! (anathema@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Friday, 13-Dec-2024 14:25:57 JST ANNA is UTOPIA!!
   im EVIL
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     John Horton Conway (johnconway@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:16:38 JST John Horton Conway

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     • ?Hidden?
     @anathema cc @hidden (this is Merc) what's the reasoning, if any, behind 'something is evil because it's alive'? Best justification I can think is some Dr. Manhattan bullshit where you have a rock-centric morality, and anything which benefits rocks is good, and life doesn't benefit rocks.
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     John Horton Conway (johnconway@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:17:06 JST John Horton Conway

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     • John Horton Conway
     @anathema @hidden best I can find from cursory searches is 'life is evil because it's flawed and finife' which is frickin stupid
     
     Am I allowed to say retarded on this instance
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     John Horton Conway (johnconway@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:17:12 JST John Horton Conway

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     • Lizzie
     @lizzie @anathema @hidden I mean replace rocks with entropy or simplicity or whatever arbitrary concept which would take some arbitrary anti life position
     
     I'd hope if rocks were alive, they'd appreciate the creativity and efficiency with which humans use them
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     Lizzie (lizzie@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:17:13 JST Lizzie

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     • John Horton Conway

     @JohnConway @anathema @hidden not the point youre making but life benefits rocks greatly. its how a lot of rocks happen (okay mostly limestone actually)

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     ANNA is UTOPIA!! (anathema@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:29:16 JST ANNA is UTOPIA!!

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     • Lizzie
     • John Horton Conway
     @JohnConway @lizzie @hidden hm "rock" or "natural" centric morality is good
     there's like "you participate in a flawed system that kills people" like a terminally online leftist but that ones dumb everyone needs groceries or whatever
     
     i see "humans will wipe out all other life in the galaxy if they continue because i can see the future" once or twice but that strikes me as human centric in a lazy way
     
     i dont think evil that hates all life for a pure evil reason is executed well often. i think evil is best done as a selfish, coveting power. this then sets up a moral for the reader of "greed is bad, you end up like sauron", which is better than "um... dont hate unreasonably!". what im trying to say is that its a less alien evil & its a more human evil , & its more relatable
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     φ (fiore@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:52:22 JST φ

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     • John Horton Conway

     @JohnConway @anathema @hidden define alive (turning this into an endless pointless thread makes me feel good n smarts )

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     John Horton Conway (johnconway@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 00:59:34 JST John Horton Conway

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     • φ
     @fiore @anathema @hidden I forget the requirements, it's like can produce more of itself, reacts to stimuli, eats, and other similar stuff. Viruses are the cutoff, Im not sure on what side they land.
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     ANNA is UTOPIA!! (anathema@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:15:03 JST ANNA is UTOPIA!!

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     • lily ?️‍⚧️
     • Lizzie
     • John Horton Conway
     @tauon @lizzie @JohnConway well all 3 of us are on the same instance ... i can see hidden's account fine. i think you probably just have cawfee club blocked
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     lily ?️‍⚧️ (tauon@possum.city)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:15:08 JST lily ?️‍⚧️

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     • Lizzie
     • John Horton Conway

     @anathema@brain.worm.pink @JohnConway@brain.worm.pink @hidden@cawfee.club @lizzie@brain.worm.pink if it helps i can't see that account either

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     ANNA is UTOPIA!! (anathema@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:15:10 JST ANNA is UTOPIA!!

     in reply to

     • ?Hidden?
     • Lizzie
     • John Horton Conway
     @JohnConway @hidden @lizzie nah we should be federating
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     John Horton Conway (johnconway@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:15:11 JST John Horton Conway

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     • Lizzie
     @anathema @hidden @lizzie I can understand there being a place for a being which wants to wipe out and thinks life is evil if it's like, an evil god or death or something, but then it's not really supposed to be relatable to humans.
     
     It would be interesting if there's a rock centric morality where it produces something similar to life, but so different that one can support that and hate life without being hypocritical.
     
     cawfee.club isn't blocked here, right
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     ANNA is UTOPIA!! (anathema@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:15:42 JST ANNA is UTOPIA!!

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     @JohnConway @hidden @lizzie reminds me of kim stanley robinson's mars trilogy there's a major political faction that is against terraforming because they want to preserve the natural state / beauty of the planet
     rock morality doesnt really work on earth though where life has been coexisting with rocks forever
     
     also u can have like ... evil slime mold. which hates life because it hates everything that isnt itself. for a simpler motivation
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     ANNA is UTOPIA!! (anathema@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:17:07 JST ANNA is UTOPIA!!

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     • lily ?️‍⚧️
     • Lizzie
     • John Horton Conway
     @tauon @lizzie @JohnConway fba has them blocked by a thousand instances :clueless:
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     lily ?️‍⚧️ (tauon@possum.city)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:17:12 JST lily ?️‍⚧️

     in reply to

     • Lizzie
     • John Horton Conway

     @anathema@brain.worm.pink @lizzie@brain.worm.pink @JohnConway@brain.worm.pink maybe. idk why that would be

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     φ (fiore@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:18:21 JST φ

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     • ?Hidden?
     • John Horton Conway

     @JohnConway @anathema @hidden i believe we should make “life” and “autopoiesis” coincide more in everyday and scientific language

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     ?Hidden? (hidden@cawfee.club)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:25:16 JST ?Hidden?

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     • John Horton Conway
     @JohnConway @anathema I'm confused what is 'something is evil because it's alive'?
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     Mercurial "The Game" Black (merc@lab.nyanide.com)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:25:16 JST Mercurial "The Game" Black

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     • John Horton Conway
     @hidden @JohnConway @anathema it's from this image
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     ?Hidden? (hidden@cawfee.club)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:25:28 JST ?Hidden?

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     • John Horton Conway
     @JohnConway @anathema I think people who think life is evil usually do so because they think that being alive entails suffering and enacting suffering and it's worth ending life to reduce suffering. For example anarchist transhumanist utilitarian types often think nature is inherently evil and warlike so being a living being is just evil
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     ?Hidden? (hidden@cawfee.club)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:56:41 JST ?Hidden?

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     • John Horton Conway
     @JohnConway @anathema Yeah. That's why I made that post like "We should make nature is warcels survive in the wild for a month like that fullmetal alchemist episode." I think actual experience with nature removes that view pretty quick when you realise that nature is both an beautiful exercise of will, and incredibly serene because you're a part of something so much greater than yourself and you fall into it perfectly. Death and suffering are much more terrifying when you're cut off from the greater picture, but immersed in it, it's completely different
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     John Horton Conway (johnconway@brain.worm.pink)'s status on Saturday, 14-Dec-2024 01:56:42 JST John Horton Conway

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     • ?Hidden?
     @hidden @anathema bleh. Those people either have such a terrible life, worse than most, or have logicked their way into hell and detached from reality.