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Catholics when you make a reasonable and well thought out counter argument to preaching in Latin, canonization of Saints, or the role of clergy in society at large.
If Protestants are such a heresy, why did Catholics give in to so many Protestant demands during the Reformation?
Could it be... just possibly... that many of those traditions had no Biblical basis?
But yeah.. be sure to pay your indulgences after Mass!
RT: https://poa.st/objects/8ca84c91-e69c-44d5-8618-c0dab25c14ce
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@Largo @wing_str I don't think it's reasonable to call Protestants heretics. Some are, but I am fine dismissing those the way I also dismiss "Catholic in name only" types.
>Could it be... just possibly... that many of those traditions had no Biblical basis?
Chicken or egg argument IMO, and I do think the RCC overstepped its authority when it became intertwined with politics. The concept of "Sola Scriptura" isn't in The Bible, to my knowledge, but you can derive it the same way you can Rome's authority— interpretation of Scripture.
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@BowsacNoodle @Largo @wing_str Most RCs don’t seem in my experience to appreciate a Church that is de jure subject to local political rulers, and not merely de facto.
This fact is symbolic of the spiritual rift that has opened up between East and West over the past millennium.
I have no simple solution beyond “begome“ - but I figure there never *will* be if the subject can’t even respectfully be broached.
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @Largo @wing_str Begome Eastern Catholic xD. Then they can experience the same Divine Liturgy and church tradition as Orthobros while keeping in communion with Rome. They don't get the patriarch connection that you guys do, but we generally care even less about Rome than the average Catholic.
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9/10 when I argue with a ardent Catholic it turns into one more more of the following
>In not a priest so I can't interpret scripture
>The Pope says
>The catechism says
>Tradition has it
The most concerning one being not being able to interpret. Like, man if you are indwelt with the Holy Spirit....why would you not be able to discern scripture. Obviously different measures of understanding to different people are given, but still. To just pass it off as "I can't"? Nah man, that's how you got it into being the Beast of revelation that it was. Teaching in Latin which very very few knew and keeping the scripture for their eyes only. Popes claiming to be God, to sacrifice Jesus at every Eucharist, etc.
It became a monopoly, and a monopolies are almost never good.
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@Omega_Variant @Largo @wing_str I can't explain church doctrine like a priest, but I read my Bible enough to give what I think is a good interpretation of it. I just never bothered to learn "church law" because it doesn't help with my salvation or winning souls for Christ. Whenever I've had a question on that type of stuff, I have priests I can ask and leity who grew up in the church who know.
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Sure, pastors should be trained and know. Many know a lot of correct stuff but I have also found many to simply regurgitate lies that they themselves have been fed.
The church at large is at a point where a large part of its doctrine is "trust me bro"/"pastor so and so said"/"I went to a (jew) seminary" level stuff. Shit I've seen some claim they are right simply because they are Catholic or x denomination.
Not everyone is concerned with laws or what's going on here or there. As a body we have different parts and different functions so what concerns me may not concern you and vice versa.
Is what it is. But we can all agree ( I think) that we are in trouble doctrinally and leadership wise.
Jesus cannot come soon enough to correct us all.
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@Omega_Variant @Largo @wing_str >simply regurgitate lies that they themselves have been fed.
Oh how true this is. One thing I appreciate of the RCC (I am not Roman Catholic) is they at least put out apologetics for things. It's like a codex of deep explanations for almost every topic. It doesn't do anything against a guy who thinks the church is evil, because they're not interested in hearing arguments "from Satan".
>As a body we have different parts and different functions so what concerns me may not concern you and vice versa.
You bring up a good point that I've not been mindful of. Thank you brother.
>But we can all agree ( I think) that we are in trouble doctrinally and leadership wise.
Amen.
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@Omega_Variant @wing_str Well Catholics have a bad habit of recording church members... at birth. Regardless of church attendance for the rest of their life.
I think that's how Poland has maintained it's "94%" Catholic status.
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Also to the OPs point, just because something is growing does not indicate it's good.
The charismatic church is growing too and it's awful. Atheism is growing, Islam is growing.
I'll throw out the story of the 400 prophets telling the king of Israel to go to war yet you had one prophet telling him that they were lying and to not go.
Turns out he listened to the 400 and died.
Largo
BowserNoodle ☦️
☦️KingOfWhiteAmerica☦️
Omega Variant
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