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   Studio 8502 :verified: (mos_8502@oldbytes.space)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 03:47:02 JST Studio 8502 :verified:

   I believe that #retrocomputing is about more than nostalgia (which is fine on its own, too!).

   I believe that it's also about a reaction to the truly sorry state of modern computing. Old computers didn't spy on you, they didn't beg you for micropayments, they just did what they were told. They were tools for work, for learning, for entertainment, not tools for the capitalists to control us even more than they already do.

   I also believe that retrocomputing has a future; we are, as a community, more than smart enough to design and build our own new retro-inspired designs, and build for ourselves a computing world worth living in.

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     Kit Rhett Aultman (roadriverrail@signs.codes)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 03:46:58 JST Kit Rhett Aultman

     in reply to

     @mos_8502 Indeed, my point of attraction is the fact that I, the lone systems software engineer, can understand every aspect of one of those machines. It's so easy to make one fully mine. And what I've learned makes me yearn for a "smol computer" that retains that perfect transparency while being suitable as a daily driver.

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     mkj (mkj@social.linux.pizza)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:08:02 JST mkj

     in reply to

     @mos_8502 One of the things that has me interested in #retrocomputing is that you actually could build a mental model of what's going on, from assembly lang instructions on up, and it wasn't totally onerous. Today, there's a gazillion layers of firmware, OS, drivers, frameworks, applications, frameworks again, virtualization/JITting, ... before you get to what you're actually telling the computer to do. Sure some of that adds value, but at some point, trying to explain it, best word is "magic".

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     Studio 8502 :verified: (mos_8502@oldbytes.space)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:08:04 JST Studio 8502 :verified:

     in reply to

     • mkj

     @mkj Also true. Which is part of why everything I design, I design out in the open. I want people to understand what I make, not least because some will know how to make it better, but also because we as the owners of technology have every right to know what the fuck it's doing and how.

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     Karsten Schmidt (toxi@mastodon.thi.ng)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:09:04 JST Karsten Schmidt

     in reply to

     @mos_8502 ? My own interest in #RetroComputing is _only_ (its relevance for) the future! Even though I do miss my Atari in some moments of weakness... :)

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     Devine Lu Linvega (neauoire@merveilles.town)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:09:12 JST Devine Lu Linvega

     in reply to

     @mos_8502

     I like this quote for this: https://iodinedynamics.com/whatkind.html

     "Wait. What nostalgia? This is not about reliving fond memories or fetishize about an imaginary past, it's about being tactical in our choice of medium, so as to propagate a political perspective efficiently."

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     Madeline :antiverified: (maddiefuzz@hackers.town)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:09:15 JST Madeline :antiverified:

     in reply to

     • Devine Lu Linvega

     @neauoire @mos_8502

     I have been and continue to be fascinated with 8-bit micros.

     I was born decades after that era. I literally cannot be motivated by nostalgia for a time I did not experience.

     The modern lens people see these computers through categorizes them as toys and relics. They have big limitations, but once you spend time with one you start to realize how capable even a 1MHz 8-bit micro is.

     We are treating computing the wrong way.

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     Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮 (longplay_games@mstdn.games)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:10:40 JST Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮

     in reply to

     • bojanland

     @bojanland @mos_8502 As a game dev and gamer I can rant endlessly about the state of consoles :D

     The big item for me is the "christmas morning experience" - if you sell a console and an 8 year old can't open it, set it up and begin playing games that were gifts under the tree within 30 minutes you've failed to make a console.
     You've just made a crippled PC.

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     bojanland (bojanland@mastodon.online)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:10:41 JST bojanland

     in reply to

     • Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮

     @Longplay_Games @mos_8502 I invited my mom to watch me play Forza Horizon, to show her how fun fake driving can be for me. She finally set aside time and came, and boom, XBOX needed to download a 10GB update. I let it run for 20 minutes before telling her that something was wrong, so we watched television instead. Microsoft forced the update on me. As a user I didn't choose it. Modern tech is about what #BigCorp wants (profit) and not what the user dreams of (fun).

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     bojanland (bojanland@mastodon.online)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:10:42 JST bojanland

     in reply to

     • Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮

     @Longplay_Games @mos_8502 I have Ubuntu installed. I was typing a tweet on twitter in Firefox. Suddenly out of nowhere pops up Upgrade app and as I was typing a space between words the space got interpreted to launch the Upgrade button as a button press and so Linux began upgrading, a 500mb upgrade in the middle of me writing a tweet, which is not what I wanted. Linux is a terribly designed GUI system. Very bad things I've seen even in 22.10 Ubuntu. I'm sure other dists are the same.

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     Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮 (longplay_games@mstdn.games)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:10:42 JST Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮

     in reply to

     • bojanland

     @bojanland @mos_8502 That's *precisely* the sort of thing I'm talking about.
     I had similar issues with Ubuntu, it's a terrible distro.

     It's not unreasonable to want an OS that never does that. Heck, I can't even use a freaking videogame console without interruptions.

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     Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮 (longplay_games@mstdn.games)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:10:43 JST Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮

     in reply to

     @mos_8502 It's literally the only reason I use linux.
     A computer is supposed to stay the heck out of the way so I can get on with why I'm using it - just like the belts on your tapedeck. It should have no shadowy existence of its own independent of you, and it should never gossip about you.

     I hate how high maintenance Windows (and even OSX and some linux variants) choose to be.

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     bojanland (bojanland@mastodon.online)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 09:10:55 JST bojanland

     in reply to

     • Longplay Games :pc_color: 🎮

     @Longplay_Games @mos_8502 Excellent point! I remember being 12 and buying a boxed C64. I didn't even speak English, we had just fled war of Yugoslavia to Canada. I was able to hook it all up to a TV where we were staying and make a BASIC program within an hour or two. That is a successful Christmas experience. :)

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     Roy Brander🇨🇦 (roybrander@urbanists.social)'s status on Monday, 13-Mar-2023 10:07:48 JST Roy Brander🇨🇦

     in reply to

     @mos_8502

     It's not about the age of the technology, it's about whether it is an empowering technology, or a control technology.

     I assure you that 1960s mainframes were used for control, wherever possible. 1970s computers one person could own were the *first* time IT was an empowering technology.

     They raced to take control away from us. The Windows OS. Unrepairable Macs.

     The "home page" (see brander.ca for a 1990s "home page") was replaced by Facebook, because it was easier than HTML.

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