Bradley M. Kühn
@amszmidt
(1/2)
As one of the leaders who has been Cc'ed on parts of this thread, the idea that I was too busy to read a thread I was cc'ed on for ≈1hr is pretty unfairly classified as “not listening”.
The idea that output of an LLM-backed generative AI system is public domain by default and in the general case is not supported by law or facts at this moment.
This issue (& many related issues) are being litigated heavily, none have been heard by SCOTUS …
Cc: @hajovonta @photex
@downey
Alfred M. Szmidt
@bkuhn It is not you who was classified as "not listening", so your account is quite unfair.
The output of LLMs is generally agreed that it is not copyrightable, and supported by law and fact at this moment simply because it lacks "human authorship".
SCOTUS or US law is not relevant where I reside.
Alfred M. Szmidt
@bkuhn None of which is relevant, SCOTUS does not exist here.
Bradley M. Kühn
(3/3) …
Likely, these issues will be highly fact-dependent. If we're lucky, some appeals Court will give us a “test” (perhaps building on the the Abstraction-Filtration-Comparison test we already have for literal copying of software (See <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abstraction-Filtration-Comparison_test>), and that new test will be actually adopted by SCOTUS as well.
Until we get there, the answer to all these questions is: “Reply hazy, try again [in a new Court case]”.
Bradley M. Kühn
(2/3) … the monkey photo case has a very different fact pattern to any of the cases currently making their way through the Courts.
As I wrote when all this started back in 2022, #MIcrosoft is attempting to manufacture consent that the behavior of the industry is either permitted by fair use and/or produces only public domain works.
https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2022/feb/03/github-copilot-copyleft-gpl/
I hope folks won't just spread the industry's unquestioned rhetoric for them.
…
Alfred M. Szmidt
@bkuhn I'm quite surprised that you're arguing that works that are void of human creativity can be copyrighted, when that is the basis of both US and all of Europe copyright law.
Bradley M. Kühn
Where is “here” for you? If you know of a jurisdiction where these issues have been settled already in their highest Courts, I very much want to read about it! Please send a link!
I apologize that I assumed you were talking about the USA — since you were talking about cases from the USA Ninth Circuit, I assumed (reasonably) you were talking about the USA.
Also, all major AI companies are in the USA, so what happens here is (possibly sadly) most relevant
@hajovonta @photex @downey
Alfred M. Szmidt
@bkuhn Such a condescending post .. I spent quite a bit on this as well. I'd hope more from you. The SFC is wrong on the topic.
Bradley M. Kühn
The issues are more complicated than that. You're conflating them; I am not sure I can help you understand better with further answers rn, but please do read my past works on the subject linked to in this thread, & watch for future publications that #SFC is working on now that we hope will delineate some of these conflated issues.
I've spent at least 100 hours of work on this stuff, & is indeed easy to conflate, so I don't blame you for being confused.
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