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   HebrideanHecate (hebrideanhecate@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:08:21 JST HebrideanHecate

   I can't help but wonder if there is more to this than first appears, also, she is American, so even more fanatical, and while ought not to be compelled to attend such a procedure, she is first and foremost a nurse, and there are times when a woman WILL die unless this happens, so could she be trusted to be safe around patients, would she try the shit of oh no, they lied to you, your baby is not seriously and horribly deformed, no, this pregnancy really won't kill you, and here are fake and harmful drugs to reverse the abortion 🙄 These people are very disingenuous.

   https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c20d12lr7p4o

   The mother-of-three, who is a US citizen, wants health boards to be more aware of freedom of speech rights. The 30-year-old joined a private social media group for midwives and trainees which has thousands of members and responded to a question about whether midwives might opt out of providing terminations.

   She shared the official guidance on conscientious objection and that she was anti-abortion. In one comment, Ms Spencer said: "Given that my moral beliefs include a foetus is a child and it it wrong to kill children, there is no circumstance in which I would not object to abortion."

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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:08:20 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     @HebrideanHecate I'm definitely of the view that people who think this way should be allowed to express their views, especially off the clock.

     However, I'm also very much of the view that if a person does not want to participate in an established medical procedure, then that person should not attempt to join a profession where the professionals are expected to perform the procedure or assist in it. (Borderline dubious and genuinely dubious procedures are another matter.)

     Jehova's witnesses for example probably shouldn't be in the medical field at all, if they believe blood transfusions are bad and immoral.

     KeepTakingTheSoma likes this.
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:16:39 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     @HebrideanHecate If she genuinely was an ethical person, she would not put herself in a position, where she might encounter an abortion in a professional setting.

     I.e. if she really wanted to deal with child bearing issues, she would stick to things like routine monitoring of easy cases, nutrition and other health education etc. The fact that she still wants to be a full midwife, AND says there's no situation where she would "not object to" abortion, means she's putting herself and her own wants ahead of the needs of the potential patients.
     That's not something a healthcare professional should do.

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     HebrideanHecate (hebrideanhecate@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:16:39 JST HebrideanHecate

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome

     @Gnomeshatecheese And that is the crux of the matter, she's not fit for the position. Not because of what she believes but what she might do on the back of that belief, or not do, as the occasion arises.

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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:16:39 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     @HebrideanHecate Exactly. She's already demonstrating her unfitness, not by her opinions, but by prioritising her own desire to be a midwife, over the needs and desires of the patients. Before she even gets into the profession even!

     Imagine a doctor wanting to become a heart surgeon, who was against bypass surgeries on people over a certain age, for whatever reason. In a sane world that person would never be allowed to specialise in that field.

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     HebrideanHecate (hebrideanhecate@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:16:39 JST HebrideanHecate

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome

     @Gnomeshatecheese It's very telling that it is midwifery she wants to do, as opposed to general nursing, and hoping she won't come up against a situation which would, in her eyes, compromise her, that to me is what makes her rather potentially dangerous and ought not to be there. I think she is being extremely sneaky about this and what her real motivations are and her "persecution". A lot of people don't actually realise how completely crazed these folk are, and the Americans are worst, they have infiltrated so much here over this and are extremely intimidating.

     KeepTakingTheSoma likes this.
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     HebrideanHecate (hebrideanhecate@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:16:40 JST HebrideanHecate

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome

     @Gnomeshatecheese Well, that's it, isn't it. I don't think she ought to be made to go and work in a clinic that specialises in this, but then she wouldn't be anyway, but what would she do if an emergency were to happen. A friend of mine, with a very much wanted pregnancy, was in just such a situation, in the end she miscarried anyway, but it was a this is going to hell very rapidly and we need to abort right now. She could not be trusted to do her job, and that makes her unsafe.

     It's not that she said it that bothers me, it is what would she not do if faced with a real crisis where her input would be required, and what undermining and other unpleasantness might she indulge in if she was to encounter a woman who was in for a termination. She could do a lot of damage.

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     KeepTakingTheSoma (keeptakingthesoma@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:24:57 JST KeepTakingTheSoma

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @HebrideanHecate @Gnomeshatecheese People in any profession can hold any beliefs they want and express them too.
     But if a person's beliefs come into conflict with the work they must do then they may be in the wrong profession. Why apply for a job you think is morally wrong or for which you are ill-suited?
     If the ethos and practices of the profession change drastically during the person's working life, then it might be important to speak up to draw attention to it. But if a person cannot continue to work there in good conscience, then they should resign.
     
     Thinking about this, what might the cases of the Darlington nurses and Sandie Peggie look like if they had made a high-profile case of resigning because not only had the ethos of providing single-sex changing spaces drastically changed in their work place, but that their union agreed with the drastic change? What if they had sparked a mass resignation of staff who also objected to the new policy?
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:25:07 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome

     @HebrideanHecate I mean, really, it's not like there are a whole host of other healthcare professions this woman could go into, where she would never need to deal with the possibility of abortion at all... 🙄 /s

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     KeepTakingTheSoma (keeptakingthesoma@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:25:40 JST KeepTakingTheSoma

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     @Gnomeshatecheese @HebrideanHecate If you can't put patients first then why be in nursing?
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     The Dread Slender Gnome (gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:45:41 JST The Dread Slender Gnome

     in reply to

     • KeepTakingTheSoma

     @KeepTakingTheSoma @HebrideanHecate That's the million pound question everyone should be asking her, isn't it.

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     HebrideanHecate (hebrideanhecate@spinster.xyz)'s status on Tuesday, 04-Mar-2025 20:45:41 JST HebrideanHecate

     in reply to

     • The Dread Slender Gnome
     • KeepTakingTheSoma

     @Gnomeshatecheese @KeepTakingTheSoma My extremely holy cousin was a midwife for years, she managed it without ever resorting to any of this drama and was a very good one too. The reason she took earlier retirement was seeing the way everything was going to hell thanks to Govt interference and cuts etc etc.

     KeepTakingTheSoma likes this.