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   Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol: (volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 01:54:06 JST Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol:

   Web search is useless. YouTube is useless. Social media, more like parasocial media. Knowledge hidden in Discord servers. Ads everywhere. LLM hallucinations everywhere. And people generally don't care. I don't see how this situation can be salvaged.

   • Doughnut Lollipop 【記録係】:blobfoxgooglymlem: likes this.
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     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:38 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • Susanna
     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:
     @adiz @volpeon @susie @aks i think some gemini clients do auto download image links like this.
     
     one of the reasons i immediately panned gemini is the lack of a genuine extension mechanism is a recipe for pain. people just told me i was stupid and to shut up. yet here we are.
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     :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶 (adiz@soc0.outrnat.nl)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:40 JST :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶

     in reply to

     • Susanna
     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     @susie@blob.cat Most static site generators like Hugo use Markdown in the backend for content creation and concerts it to HTML on publish. @volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip @aks@scalie.zone

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     Susanna (susie@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:41 JST Susanna

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     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:
     @adiz @volpeon @aks Honestly, I would have been fine with Gemini if they would have just made embedding photos and videos a thing in the spec. Of course I could code a "gemini browser" which would do those things, but it would be a hack and the people writing gemini sites wouldn't want to adjust their pages for it (put video and image links in between the text rather than at the end etc).
     
     Honestly a markdown based "html alternative" with native image and video embedding (using system codecs maybe) could easily become a "next big thing" in self-hosting circles. Sure, you can do that with html+css too, but it would be "cool" and allow for writing tons of different clients.
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     :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶 (adiz@soc0.outrnat.nl)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:42 JST :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶

     in reply to

     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     @volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip Yeah, I didn't understand the point considering Gopher still exists. People could just use Gopher and essentially get the same experience. I guess the same argument could be made about any alternative protocol, e.g. if we remade an HTML+CSS-only type protocol. @aks@scalie.zone

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     Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol: (volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:44 JST Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol:

     in reply to

     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     @adiz@soc0.outrnat.nl @aks@scalie.zone It wasted a lot of potential to make things actually better and focused on building a Gopher 2.0, where text content was king and nothing else mattered.

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     :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶 (adiz@soc0.outrnat.nl)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:45 JST :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶

     in reply to

     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     @volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip Gemini is a cute toy. That's about it. @aks@scalie.zone

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     Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol: (volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:46 JST Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol:

     in reply to

     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     @aks@scalie.zone That's mostly how I use it, but sometimes you inadvertently get pulled onto that side because there's no clear separation. :neofox_googly_shocked: Gemini was onto something, but it was useless for someone like me who wants to show off their visual works.

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     Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde: (aks@scalie.zone)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:03:47 JST Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     in reply to

     @volpeon ignore the corporate internet, just do your own thing

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     Pissed Hippo (sun@shitposter.world)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:05:20 JST Pissed Hippo

     in reply to

     • Susanna
     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:
     @volpeon @susie @adiz @aks you could do this with an html microformat and a little bit of js
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     Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol: (volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 03:05:21 JST Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol:

     in reply to

     • Susanna
     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     • Akseli :quake_verified:​ :kde:

     @susie@blob.cat @adiz@soc0.outrnat.nl @aks@scalie.zone Media is a big part of it, but I think it also would've been nice if it just tried to be less like the web, paradoxically.
     
     For instance, here's an idea I've had when I was still invested in Gemini. Sites all have a hierarchial structure which is presented by a menu. With Gopher and HTTP, the menu is implemented by web masters using links.
     But what if instead the protocol included a specification to define the hierarchy which the browser then can download and use to show a menu itself? This would be amazing because on the desktop, browsers can just show a menu bar at the top, but on mobile it could be a hamburger menu instead -- all without CSS and viewport queries. *That's* the sort of thinking that would've yielded a good alternative.

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     Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol: (volpeon@is-a.wyvern.rip)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 04:17:55 JST Volpeon :drgn_verified: :drgn_smol:

     in reply to

     • Susanna
     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     • Pissed Hippo

     @sun@shitposter.world @susie@blob.cat @adiz@soc0.outrnat.nl That's not the point, though. You can't possibly "win" against the web if your objective is "better features" because anything is already possible on the web. You have top choose a different playing field, and I see the best chance in a protocol that's more lightweight and less flexible than HTTP (to hopefully avoid the kind of invasive tracking and anti-patterns we have here), but focuses on providing features to get sites up and running with little effort. A menu system like I described above is one such thing. But if we think further, what about a set of higher level components that mirror patterns we encounter on the web pretty often? Instead of a dumb image element, we could have an image list component which can be displayed as a dumb list of links by less capable browsers, and as a proper grid with thumbnails and captions by more powerful browsers? How about a lightbox component, something which to this day requires JavaScript on the web?
     Trade flexibility with more "bang for the buck". That's the only way I can see a protocol that's supposed to be an alternative to the web gaining traction.

     Pissed Hippo likes this.
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     Pissed Hippo (sun@shitposter.world)'s status on Saturday, 27-Jul-2024 04:25:44 JST Pissed Hippo

     in reply to

     • Susanna
     • :verified_2:防空識別區𝒔𝒐𝒄𝟶
     @volpeon @susie @adiz I misunderstood your point, thanks for the clarification