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1. Embed this notice
   stux⚡ (stux@mstdn.social)'s status on Friday, 31-May-2024 06:38:01 JST stux⚡

   She has a real good example of how algorithms on platforms like Instagram not only try to make you addicted but also divide us even more

   I real LOVE the fact Mastodon and most of the Fediverse software avoids this all together

   • Embed this notice
     mekka okereke :verified: (mekkaokereke@hachyderm.io)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:08 JST mekka okereke :verified:

     in reply to

     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @ddritter

     Twitter:
     *I make a post at 9am and go about my day
     *A racist replies with racial slurs at 9:15am
     *Everyone sees the racist replies
     *Everyone reports the racist replies
     *Twitter mods take it down by 10am
     *I check Twitter again at 11am, and never even see the racism!

     Masto:
     *I post at 9am
     *Racists reply in such a way that only me, them and their followers, see the racism
     *So no one reports it
     *Everyone gaslights me with "I don't see racism here!"

     https://hachyderm.io/@mekkaokereke/111012743709881062

     Paul Cantrell repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     mekka okereke :verified: (mekkaokereke@hachyderm.io)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:09 JST mekka okereke :verified:

     in reply to

     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @ddritter

     Yes I'm very sure. It's much easier to abuse Black people here on the Fediverse.

   • Embed this notice
     DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸 (ddritter@paquita.masto.host)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:09 JST DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:

     @mekkaokereke Ouch. Sorry to hear that. I thought that mastodon was better than the other social sites because here you can choose an instance that provides some protection via blocking or filtering.

     If you have info about how and why Mastodon is worse than Xitter I would appreciate it.

     Thanks.

     Tobias Hellgren and GreenSkyOverMe (Monika) repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸 (ddritter@paquita.masto.host)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:10 JST DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:

     @mekkaokereke Are you sure it's not easier to racially abuse black people on Xitter? I'm sure you even get a default boost there nowadays.

   • Embed this notice
     mekka okereke :verified: (mekkaokereke@hachyderm.io)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:11 JST mekka okereke :verified:

     in reply to

     @stux

     Maybe?

     Other social:
     "Everyone sees every reply! But we fiddle with the order!"

     Mastodon:
     "Not everyone sees every reply! But the order of posts that are seen, is guaranteed to be strictly reverse chronological!"

     Different trade-offs inherent in the architecture of each.

     I've posted on here before about how Mastodon's trade-off makes it much easier to racially abuse Black people in the replies, and puts more of the burden of reporting that abuse on victims rather than the community.

   • Embed this notice
     stux⚡ (stux@mstdn.social)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:12 JST stux⚡

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:

     @mekkaokereke Also, replies are always in the "same order", ofc sometimes some are missing due to blocks or non-federated etc

     But it won't give a per-user based selection of replies based on once interested/gender etc

     I count that as a win

   • Embed this notice
     stux⚡ (stux@mstdn.social)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:13 JST stux⚡

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:

     @mekkaokereke Is that based from the code?

   • Embed this notice
     mekka okereke :verified: (mekkaokereke@hachyderm.io)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:14 JST mekka okereke :verified:

     in reply to

     @stux

     Yes it does. It's just slower and more manual.

     Because in Mastodon, a boost is closer to a "like" on other platforms.

     If I start boosting a lot of crypto spam, mods on other servers will be like, "Crypto spam?! Seriously?! What happened to him?! This dude sucks now! Hachyderm, handle that, or else!" Then if Hachyderm doesn't, other admins may defed Hachyderm, or block me individually.

     Instances that don't like people that like crypto spam, don't let their users see my posts.

   • Embed this notice
     mekka okereke :verified: (mekkaokereke@hachyderm.io)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:14 JST mekka okereke :verified:

     in reply to

     @stux

     On all platforms, a like and a boost communicate two things:

     1) I enjoyed this! (Enjoy)
     2) Other people should see this! (Visibility)

     On a platform like TikTok, the "like" button gives a score of 1.0 to "Enjoy" and N<1.0 to "Visibility." TikTok gives the "repost" button a score of N>0.0 to "Enjoy" and N<1.0 to "Visibility."

     Mastodon gives the "like" button a score of 1.0 to "Enjoy" and 0.0 to "Visibility." It gives boost a score of 1.0 to "Enjoy" and a score of 1.0 to "Visibility."

   • Embed this notice
     stux⚡ (stux@mstdn.social)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:15 JST stux⚡

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:

     @mekkaokereke True but it does NOT serve you posts based on who you are, you are and what you like to fuel the fire even more 😉

     The only thing that could happen is that posts are missing because of blocks indeed

   • Embed this notice
     mekka okereke :verified: (mekkaokereke@hachyderm.io)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 03:23:16 JST mekka okereke :verified:

     in reply to

     @stux

     🤔 People keep saying that Mastodon doesn't have this problem "because no algorithms," but Mastodon absolutely does have this problem.

     For example, whether or not a fediverse user sees this post that I'm writing right now, depends on whether or not their admin thinks that they should see posts from hachyderm, or from me in particular. 🤷🏿♂️

     Someone is still deciding which replies you see and which ones you don't see, presumably for your safety and enjoyment.

   • Embed this notice
     Mastodon Migration (mastodonmigration@mastodon.online)'s status on Saturday, 03-Aug-2024 11:30:26 JST Mastodon Migration

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     ☝️ This is a really good explanation of why "Followers only" replies are a problem. ☝️

   • Embed this notice
     Erin 💽✨ (erincandescent@akko.erincandescent.net)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:47 JST Erin 💽✨

     in reply to

     • myrmepropagandist
     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • Piers Cawley
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @futurebird @pdcawley @mekkaokereke @ddritter I’ve used DM replies to add something to a conversation I don’t want to be public. I’ve rarely seen a good use of Followers-only replies though.

     But its important to understand that “visibility settings” aren’t in the protocol - Public is to: [as:Public, yourUserAccount/followers, everyone, mentioned]; followers only is to: [yourUserAccount/Followers, everyone, mentioned]; DM is to: [everyone, mentioned]

     “Visibility Settings” and the in-post addressing is an elaborate fiction Mastodon imposed on top of a more flexible protocol

   • Embed this notice
     myrmepropagandist (futurebird@sauropods.win)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:48 JST myrmepropagandist

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • Piers Cawley
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @pdcawley @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     I HATE unboostable replies. It always feels like someone grabbed me and pulled me into a dark ally to "talk"

     Especially since if I respond I might not be able to boost my own reply to them without stripping stuff out of the post and maybe breaking the thread.

     I don't get why people do it? I tend to mute without comment anyone who seems like a bad actor which works well. So I'm not suffering much, but I've seen this hurt other people.

     naskya::dev repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     Piers Cawley (pdcawley@mendeddrum.org)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:50 JST Piers Cawley

     in reply to

     • myrmepropagandist
     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @futurebird @mekkaokereke @ddritter having non DM type replies invisible to a victim's followers, and un-boostable or QT-able to boot is just too fucked up for words.

     But… here we are, in the land of unverifiable screenshots.

   • Embed this notice
     myrmepropagandist (futurebird@sauropods.win)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:51 JST myrmepropagandist

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • Piers Cawley
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @pdcawley @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     I think eliminating it could be a valid move. Especially since we don't have quote tweets for a similar reason.

     Likewise I could see having *both* implemented. Having one but not the other is what makes no sense to me.

   • Embed this notice
     Piers Cawley (pdcawley@mendeddrum.org)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:52 JST Piers Cawley

     in reply to

     • myrmepropagandist
     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @futurebird @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     I recognise that I'm probably just another privileged asshole at this point, but is that a bad thing? Especially when eliminating 'followers only' replies (or its current behaviour) genuinely seems to eliminate a very nasty form of abusive posting?

     Me, I'd make followers only replies work similarly to the way mentions only toots do – make them visible to the followers of everyone mentioned in the toot, but only push them to the replier's followers.

   • Embed this notice
     myrmepropagandist (futurebird@sauropods.win)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:53 JST myrmepropagandist

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • Piers Cawley
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @pdcawley @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     That would reach a wider group of people.

   • Embed this notice
     Piers Cawley (pdcawley@mendeddrum.org)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:54 JST Piers Cawley

     in reply to

     • myrmepropagandist
     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @futurebird @mekkaokereke @ddritter I'm not sure I understand what a followers only reply achieves over and above you adding a cw.

     Doesn't a public reply plus a self-boost achieve the same result?

   • Embed this notice
     myrmepropagandist (futurebird@sauropods.win)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:55 JST myrmepropagandist

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • Piers Cawley
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @pdcawley @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     I can think of non-abusive uses for it. For example if I wanted to share a news story about US pol, but the story isn't CW'd and I've been trying to be consistent about zipping most of that content since I feel bad for internationals and the post volume is grotesque.

     So I could write a reply, cw my reply and use it to share a call to action or something?

     However, it also has *more* abuse potential that quote tweets IMO.

   • Embed this notice
     Piers Cawley (pdcawley@mendeddrum.org)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:56 JST Piers Cawley

     in reply to

     • myrmepropagandist
     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @futurebird @mekkaokereke @ddritter I confess, I'm at a loss to think of non-abusive uses of followers only replies.

     Followers only posts, sure, but replies? Nothing but an abuse vector.

   • Embed this notice
     myrmepropagandist (futurebird@sauropods.win)'s status on Sunday, 04-Aug-2024 19:12:57 JST myrmepropagandist

     in reply to

     • mekka okereke :verified:
     • DDRitter 🏳️‍🌈🎗️🇵🇸

     @mekkaokereke @ddritter

     Follower's only replies totally have this potential for abuse. And I can see the argument for addressing them given that one of the major reasons quote tweets don't exist is "potential for abuse" (much to my annoyance if I'm honest)

     There is precedent for making such decisions based on potential for abuse... that's my main point here.

     Having one but not the other is ... interesting.