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@alienghic @cwebber I get what you mean, but I insist that catastrophic collapse and gradual decline, forced upon us by external circumstances or internal failure, do not count as degrowth.

I think we need to maintain the definition of degrowth as *intentionally* climbing down off the cliff, carefully retreating while protecting the most vulnerable, rather than waiting for all of our shit to be destroyed by mother nature / physics. Otherwise degrowth is a bad word