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@antifarben @dbattistella @chris The other is my own opinion. Ukraine (just like Israel) are proxies for the west.

There is a video of Biden, from the time he was a senator, talking about the importance of the USA keeping Israel, due their interest in the middle east.

The same goes for Ukraine, IMO, the difference in that case is that Putin is a shithead and must be stopped.

I am talking from South America, we know very well what is in the interest of the west. And the worst of all, USA. But this is a looong History.