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   iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Wednesday, 15-Apr-2026 21:33:18 JST iced depresso
   > france embraces matrix to build tchap
   
   that's a complete misspelling of XMPP and for that we're not repealing the rule that french should not be spoken :blobcatnomouth:
   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Wednesday, 15-Apr-2026 21:33:14 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @mangeurdenuage IRC is pretty basic and formally verifiable. XMPP you have to pick a particular subset but you could do so and formally verify it.
     
     Matrix's federation protocols are not only basically unverified but they fail (and have failed, repeatedly, because they have to keep updating the room version to fix bugs) it on top of being incredibly onerous to implement. There's a lot of stupid issues like the fact if someone is banned from a room they can still flood it with hitlerposts because "well, the timestamp on that claims to be before the ban event so it could just be old news" and there's a whole vibes bit on how to process malignant inputs like this.
     
     like the protocol is just specifically bad.
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     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Wednesday, 15-Apr-2026 21:33:16 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @mangeurdenuage i just think matrix is an ass protocol and i say this as someone who wrote a server for it once. the room reconciliation protocol should make everyone go nope and leave.
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     mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius: (mangeurdenuage@shitposter.world)'s status on Wednesday, 15-Apr-2026 21:33:17 JST mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:

     in reply to
     @icedquinn The parasites around the people in power are always altering the words of the people who gave them the solutions.
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     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Thursday, 16-Apr-2026 03:32:52 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     • 🌈ᚩ🌈
     @bonifartius @mangeurdenuage business clients have basically infinitely arbitrary requirements and they can't meet those because the sync protocol doesn't support "there's a legal hold on this so nobody can delete it ever" at the same time as "gdpr exists on tuesdays so now you have to delete these records, until gets repealed on friday because the minister decided privacy laws hurt Big AI[1]"
     
     [1] https://www.theregister.com/2026/04/08/japan_privacy_law_changes_ai/
   • Embed this notice
     🌈ᚩ🌈 (bonifartius@noauthority.social)'s status on Thursday, 16-Apr-2026 03:32:53 JST 🌈ᚩ🌈

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:

     @icedquinn @mangeurdenuage i think matrix is an interesting idea but an exploratory prototype at best.

     the distributed graph sync stuff might be nice for small-medium companies where you actually have a requirements for infinite log for accountability.

     it's certainly shit for replacing IRC or XMPP, both are the complete opposite in functionality. matrix just doesn't scale.

   • Embed this notice
     🌈ᚩ🌈 (bonifartius@noauthority.social)'s status on Thursday, 16-Apr-2026 04:37:48 JST 🌈ᚩ🌈

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:

     @icedquinn @mangeurdenuage pretty sure gdpr is not relevant for company use because you are a cog in the machine, not a private person there. only has to be signed off at hiring that you can't use company shit for private purposes.

     only way around infinite business requirements is a bespoke chat. yet everyone uses teams and slack. something sunk cost fallacy. mattermost might be the most flexible stuff, but the code is horrible go written like java.

   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Thursday, 16-Apr-2026 04:37:48 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     • 🌈ᚩ🌈
     @bonifartius @mangeurdenuage teams and slack are compatible with general regulatory domains.
     
     centralized servers are basically required at the business level because its structurally impossible to comply with arbitrarily changing legal orders otherwise.
     
     and there can still be legal deletion orders against a company. if an employee pastes PII in the wrong tab, or the matrix server serves customer support reqs, or people are talking about someone else you could still get slapped with "disclose every record you have of X person" requests.
     
     some of the business platforms have 'legal hold' APIs because you aren't allowed to delete the S3 bucket for the next ten years of litigation. but you might also be compelled to delete another S3 bucket due to terrorism law of the week. etc.
     
     it's a really bad interplay with things like blockchains. xtdb had to engineer around this, nxt used a similar idea, of separating the blockchain for provenance from the data, because you NEED the chain of events to stay forever, but you *might* need to dump the contents of what the record was (storing the hash to prove that it belongs there, if you have it, while being able to delete it because its child porn.)
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     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 04:57:02 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading:
     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @m0xEE @mangeurdenuage discord claims to do E2EE with voice chats, but afaik there is no way to prove it isn't backdoored.
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     :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading: (m0xee@breloma.m0xee.net)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 04:57:04 JST :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading:

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @icedquinn @mangeurdenuage
     > what people like discord actually do
     Does Discord have E2EE in any form at all though? You appear to be more knowledgeable about this than I am, but won't that drastically increase the amount of side-channel exchange if intentionally partition rooms like that and slap cryptography over it? :marseyhmm:
     
     It's just for the sake of correctness — sure, Matrix isn't perfect, some things are done better elsewhere, but if you take a step back — no one else does everything it does, even XMPP isn't 1-to-1 replacement, when it comes to some features it's not like XMPP offers a superior implementation, it offers a superior absence of the feature :marseyemojismilemoutheyes:
     And sure, simpler things can be way better at doing the few things they do and it's only a matter of what you are up to living without — for some even IRC gets the job done.
   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 04:57:05 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading:
     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @m0xEE @mangeurdenuage yes :cirno_shrug: CAP theorem is a bitch.
     
     probably best off just letting multiple servers handle very large MUCs, let them split, and negentropy sync when repairing the partitions. which incidentally is also what people like discord actually do.
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     :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading: (m0xee@breloma.m0xee.net)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 04:57:07 JST :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading:

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @icedquinn @mangeurdenuage
     And in XMPP this is solved by… rooms not being decentralised? :marseyhmmm:
   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 04:59:05 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :marseyloadingneon: m0xEE :marseyloading:
     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @m0xEE @mangeurdenuage > superior absence of the feature
     
     it has had several encrypt all the things XEPs over the years. i think there are even some to do voice calls.
     
     this is just getting back to my previous statements that third places died because people enjoy being atomized. the specs are right there. the clients are right there. nobody is willing to put in the work for free to reach some imaginary gold standard. and corpos that will put in the work want it to be owned and closed. :cirno_shrug:
   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 05:24:31 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • anemone
     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @anemone @mangeurdenuage i have done those things
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 05:24:32 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @icedquinn@blob.cat @mangeurdenuage@shitposter.world Here's the problem: I can actually use matrix (I can send and get messages from other people, I can use encryption). With XMPP, I cannot do those things.
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     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 05:28:36 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • anemone
     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @anemone @mangeurdenuage i run a server which has been doing those things and a contacts list of people who have also been doing the thing. at some point it becomes a skill issue.
     
     you can even manage to fuck up operating matrix, it's not a protocol problem. its a labor one, and most people "never having a problem with matrix" is literally them using it exactly like discord (new vector's home server, probably even element served off the new vector server.)
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     anemone@ebiverse.social's status on Saturday, 18-Apr-2026 05:28:37 JST anemone

     in reply to

     • mangeurdenuage :gnu: :trisquel: :gondola_head: 🌿 :abeshinzo: :ignucius:
     @icedquinn@blob.cat @mangeurdenuage@shitposter.world works on my machineok