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   Raito Bezarius (raito@nixos.paris)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 02:50:20 JST Raito Bezarius

   • Dave Anderson

   @danderson i'd kinda kill for something like systemd directives that does pass the socket

   "StopWhenUnroutableTo=0.0.0.0/0"
   "StartWhenRoutableTo=0.0.0.0/0"

   etc.

   but unsure where is the right design and what direction should we go

   • Embed this notice
     Erin 💽✨ (erincandescent@akko.erincandescent.net)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 02:50:18 JST Erin 💽✨

     in reply to

     • Dave Anderson
     @raito @danderson a condition on a route to 0.0.0.0/0 would mean my routers were never considered online (and also is a hard dependency on IPv4), and meanwhile most of my computers would think they're online even when the network is broken.
     
     TBH I lean towards the idea that there's no way to test if you're "online" except reaching out to something on the internet
     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 03:04:33 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

     • Dave Anderson
     • Erin 💽✨

     @erincandescent @danderson @raito And I've yet to see a service-management case where you'd need online/offline status (whatever that means). For services just need to check if networking is configured (daemon listening to a specific IP address), or even just check there's a networking stack (daemon binding to 0.0.0.0 / ::0).

     Although as systemd also munched cron there's also that, but for those given that internet isn't just online/offline, better to just have the script handle that or just fail, rather than get silently disabled because systemd couldn't reach something that might have been firewalled out.

     And personally I much prefer using things like runlevels to turn of groups of services, which can be network manager itself, which could get linked to an Airplane Mode button.

   • Embed this notice
     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 03:09:20 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

     • Dave Anderson
     • Erin 💽✨
     @raito @erincandescent @danderson To me those are doomed to be stuck to busy loops, because they have a dependency on an external machine.
     
     Like what happens if you reboot the machine you have an ssh tunnel to?
   • Embed this notice
     Raito Bezarius (raito@nixos.paris)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 03:09:22 JST Raito Bezarius

     in reply to

     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     • Dave Anderson
     • Erin 💽✨

     @lanodan @erincandescent @danderson i have plenty of those

     "create an ssh tunnel once online"
     "swap the http proxy settings once connected to VPN X which has a route to Y"

     and currently they use a bunch of wait-for-online stuff that is not really nice and too many busy loops

   • Embed this notice
     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: (lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 03:10:38 JST Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:

     in reply to

     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     • Dave Anderson
     • Erin 💽✨
     @raito @danderson @erincandescent Although the VPN case just sounds like you want your VPN service to give readiness notification.
   • Embed this notice
     anna (navi@social.vlhl.dev)'s status on Sunday, 16-Feb-2025 03:29:42 JST anna

     in reply to

     • Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell:
     • Dave Anderson
     • Erin 💽✨
     @lanodan @erincandescent @danderson @raito
     
     for the vpn one i'd say you'd just want hooks, e.g. with ifupdown-ng, have a hook that notifies the proxy once vpn x's interface is up
     Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: likes this.