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   silverpill (silverpill@mitra.social)'s status on Friday, 31-Jan-2025 20:48:52 JST silverpill

   @licho @helge I think @context might be useful for documenting properties and types. But that's it. JSON-LD processing doesn't seem to solve any problem developers face in the real world, and I know several cases where developers started with JSON-LD-first approach and then regretted it :)

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     Fish of Rage (sun@shitposter.world)'s status on Friday, 31-Jan-2025 20:59:43 JST Fish of Rage

     in reply to
     @silverpill I tried starting with json-ld-first and regretted it. i really gave it a serious try.
     
     it is TOO "flexible" for parsing if you assume you are going to take any valid json-ld. matching on expanded form is also awful.
     silverpill repeated this.
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     lainy (lain@lain.com)'s status on Friday, 31-Jan-2025 21:02:14 JST lainy

     in reply to
     @silverpill @licho @helge i have yet to find a single reason to actually engage with the LD part, it's completely useless. There's no situation I ever heard about where it would be useful (on the fediverse).
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     FenTiger (fentiger@zotum.net)'s status on Friday, 31-Jan-2025 21:17:00 JST FenTiger

     in reply to
     This was my experience too.
     
     It also doesn't play very well in practice with JCS canonicalisation, as used by FEP-8b32 signatures: #^https://zotum.net/channel/fentiger?mid=d9557d63-a9e5-4bba-a39d-e2ee785def42
     
     Trying to treat messages as "JSON-LD first" has taken me a very long way down a blind alley, and cost me a lot of time.
     
     :(
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     Fish of Rage (sun@shitposter.world)'s status on Friday, 31-Jan-2025 23:30:18 JST Fish of Rage

     in reply to

     • Raphael Lullis
     @raphael @silverpill Elixir, but I glossed over a lot of details about issues I was having. I actually found a big problem with the json-ld library in Elixir I was using but was able to code around it.
     
     A lot of the issues were honestly problems with activitypub and json-ld, like it doesn't matter if you use json-ld, you have to assume that your recipients do not so you have to write custom code to force your output to something that mastodon recognizes.
     
     I tried to find a database for storing json-ld (or rdf or turtle) and then lets you query on it and there are few options and they all suck.
     
     There is zero benefit to json-ld and lots of unnecessary cost. I tried really hard to make it work.
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     Raphael Lullis (raphael@mastodon.communick.com)'s status on Friday, 31-Jan-2025 23:30:28 JST Raphael Lullis

     in reply to

     • Fish of Rage

     @sun @silverpill

     What programming language are you using? Pretty much any RDF library can parse JSON-LD.

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     silverpill (silverpill@mitra.social)'s status on Saturday, 01-Feb-2025 00:03:15 JST silverpill

     in reply to

     • Raphael Lullis

     @raphael I don't have any issues with parsing data. Maybe JSON-LD makes it easier to parse different kinds of values (string vs object vs array), but in the grand scheme of things this is not a significant advantage, which is dwarfed by interop issues, poor performance and increased cognitive load. Moreover, the problem with value variability is the problem that was created by JSON-LD in the first place (and which can be fixed by standard JSON schemas).

     @licho @helge

     Fish of Rage likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Raphael Lullis (raphael@mastodon.communick.com)'s status on Saturday, 01-Feb-2025 00:03:16 JST Raphael Lullis

     in reply to

     @silverpill @licho @helge

     > JSON-LD processing doesn't seem to solve any problem developers face in the real world

     To me, it's the opposite. Without JSON-LD, my application needs to have a bunch of parsing/serializing code in order to talk with everyone else. With JSON-LD, we could just rely on any RDF library and get the data structures that we need right away.

     By avoiding JSON-LD, you end up dealing with *more* complexity, not less.