Diego Elio Pettenò
End of the year appears to have woken up networking folks trying to convince us that 2025 is definitely the year of
#IPv6!
If you believe so, help me collect services that are totally definitely available over IPv6, to show that v4 is legacy, and users can totally give it up!
Rich Felker
@flameeyes Can we please just turn off IPv4 and let all the straggler shit catch up or die?
Rich Felker
@flameeyes I just abandoned caring what ISPs have and routed all thru a VPS I control. So sick of no-v6, blocked ports, etc.
But if v4 suddenly stopped working, ISPs would all have v6 in a hurry...
Diego Elio Pettenò
@dalias I'm this {} close to just turn off IPv6 on my local network — mostly because I have no idea if my next ISP will have it, and Tailscale filled in the needs I had for IPv6.
Rich Felker
@flameeyes "Actually being able to access all my machines from anywhere in the world" is not an ideological purity point.
It's "IPv4 and having everything behind NAT is unusably broken unless you want to be a pure consumer".
Diego Elio Pettenò
@dalias I have too many things I enjoy in life more than maintaining my own network infrastructure for what ends up being at this point ideological purity points 🤷
Diego Elio Pettenò
@dalias as I said, @tailscale covers that niche for me at this point, I don't need IPv6 to solve it.
Rich Felker
@flameeyes Only a very small number of people's needs can be met this way by @tailscale. The numbers don't work. The IPv4 space is too small. I don't advocate for "solutions" that necessarily exclude most of the world's people.
Rich Felker
@flameeyes @tailscale FWIW I'm also angry at the v6 architects who were/are like "just pass out /64's or even /48's everywhere!" This, combined with special meaning of the prefix bits, will lead to the same kind of stupid unforced-error scarcity we had with v4.
Diego Elio Pettenò
@dalias only a very small number of people care to access every one of their machines anywhere in the world.
I keep repeating this for over sevne years: it's a geeks' wet dream – something _we_ as a category keep wanting, but don't realize most of the rest of the world *doesn't care* they're not able to.
Rich Felker
@flameeyes No, the ability to make devices whereby EVERYONE can do that is necessary to building a world where abusive powerful entities don't control and mediate everyone's communications, social interactions, storage of personal memories, etc.
Rich Felker
@flameeyes I just love how "actually seeking to change the world for the better" is deemed a forfeit... 🙄
That kinda thing might have worked on legacy techbro+capitalist social media. Not likely to fly on the fedi.
Diego Elio Pettenò
@dalias I rest my case.
Diego Elio Pettenò
@dalias I'm not sure what you expect me to do?
I'm trying to explain to you that the wider world doesn't want to be force fed the dream of geeks, because most of them have other things in life beside maintaining their own infra, but instead you take it as a way to tell me to get out of here?
Rich Felker
@flameeyes Nobody wants to be told what to do. Nobody wants taking responsibility for your own autonomy to require being a fucking geek except asshole elitist geeks. That's why we want a world where you don't need tailscale or vps expertise to put a device built to serve your needs online.
Rich Felker
@flameeyes Mocking the idea that we could make devices easy enough for nearly everyone, without backdoors for some business behind them to control everything about them, has about the same vibes as mocking the idea that non capitalist social media could thrive and become mainstream.
Rich Felker
@raggi @flameeyes @tailscale That's not true because the first 16 bits are not arbitrarily assignable.
James Tucker
@dalias @flameeyes @tailscale /48 is the minimum allocation unit to prevent the global routing tables growing too fast. There are 65536 times more /48s than there are individual ipv4 addresses. If you gave each /48 route a single 64 bit integer identifier and put only those identifiers in a single array as a very compact routing table, it would take up 2PB!
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