Conversation

Notices

1. Embed this notice
   David August (davidaugust@mastodon.online)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Dec-2024 06:26:45 JST David August

   #precedent #pardons #USpol

   • Embed this notice
     Zimmie (bob_zim@infosec.exchange)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Dec-2024 07:20:21 JST Zimmie

     in reply to

     • ArchaeoIain

     @ArchaeoIain @davidaugust > Miscarriages of justice can be dealt with by the courts.

     Which courts? Specifically which ones? And where do we go when those fail us? And where do we go when *that* court fails us? It’s not practical to have an infinite series of courts for appeals, so it has to end somewhere. What do you do when the final court is hopelessly corrupt?

     Consider the crime of “felony murder”, which is also known as “not murdering anybody at all”. The fact anybody is in prison over this is inherently a miscarriage of justice, yet it’s very rarely fixed by the courts.

     Edit: looks like the equivalent legal concept in Australia is “constructive murder”. In the US, if you are involved in any way with a felony (even an unwitting accessory) and someone dies (regardless of who or of circumstances), you can be charged with murder. Of course, if you actually kill someone, they charge you with real murder, not with “felony murder”. Stealing as little as $200 is a felony in various states.

     Pardon power is good, and isn’t used nearly often enough.

   • Embed this notice
     ArchaeoIain (archaeoiain@archaeo.social)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Dec-2024 07:20:22 JST ArchaeoIain

     in reply to

     @davidaugust but we all know the US Constitution is idiotic. Trouble is that if you get to the stage of amending it, under the next President, you could end up truly unbearble.
     It is irrelevant how many other countries have pardon provisions. Many other countries had fascist governments, and probably all were racist. That does not justify them.
     Miscarriages of justice can be dealt with by the courts. Does not apply to Kushner or Biden.

     GreenSkyOverMe (Monika) repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     David August (davidaugust@mastodon.online)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Dec-2024 07:20:23 JST David August

     in reply to

     • ArchaeoIain

     @ArchaeoIain Perhaps it is is need of reform.

     However, it would require a Constitutional Amendment and Amendments are both difficult to get and also risk revision of other elements of the document too.

     Pardon powers significantly predate existence of the United States and at least twenty-four (24) other countries currently have a pardon power provisions.

     Pardon powers exist for many reasons, including a chance to set miscarriages of justice right. Biden may use them that way in coming weeks.

   • Embed this notice
     ArchaeoIain (archaeoiain@archaeo.social)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Dec-2024 07:20:24 JST ArchaeoIain

     in reply to

     @davidaugust the problem here is the institution of pardoning, not the people doing it or the people it is done to. Presidential pardons should be abolished.