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   feb (feb@loma.ml)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 04:06:16 JST feb

   • Evan Prodromou
   Hier gerät etwas in Schieflage. Sehr schade.
   RE: cosocial.ca/users/evan/statuse…
   • Embed this notice
     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 04:06:14 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     @feb what's wrong with it? Do you think too many people would give consent to let researchers use their data, or too few? Why?

   • Embed this notice
     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 04:07:58 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     @feb you saw that I'm at a Trust and Safety Research Conference today, where academic researchers talked about processes for getting consent from subjects to share data, right?

     https://conferences.law.stanford.edu/tsrc/

   • Embed this notice
     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 04:50:13 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • hiker

     @Hiker @feb Not even opt-in, with consent? Why not?

   • Embed this notice
     hiker (hiker@social.fedcast.ch)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 04:50:15 JST hiker

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     @feb @evan
     Exactly !
     It is **our** data and nobody has the right to do anything with it. Otherwise every admin would have to ask their users for permission.
     No, such projects **definitely** do not belong in the #Fediverse.
   • Embed this notice
     feb (feb@loma.ml)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 04:50:16 JST feb

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     @evan This data is earmarked for a specific purpose that does not provide for any other use. Not even for research purposes.
     Every node in Fediverse would immediately violate the GDPR.
   • Embed this notice
     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:16:19 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • hiker

     @Hiker @feb It's a really good point. I am not sure how researchers in social networks deal with incidental data from other users.

   • Embed this notice
     hiker (hiker@social.fedcast.ch)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:16:20 JST hiker

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     @evan
     Sorry, seems like a rhetorical question to me.
     
     In such a distributed, decentralized network with so many servers, where the data is so interconnected, how can you guarantee the individual user that their data will not be used? After all, their data is not only stored on their home server, but distributed across the entire network.
     
     But you can try to convince me on the technical and data protection side. @feb
   • Embed this notice
     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:22:31 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     @feb The question is about academic researchers doing scientific studies, either in computer science, or in social sciences.

   • Embed this notice
     feb (feb@loma.ml)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:22:32 JST feb

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou

     @evan Make it a binding standard. Make sure that all projects implement it. Ensure that no further data flows from users who have not consented to this. Ensure that these ‘companies’ comply with all GDPR requirements and follow ethical principles.

     Do they really think that's realistic?
     It's nothing more than a back door that creates further desires.

   • Embed this notice
     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:26:34 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • hiker

     @Hiker @feb There aren't specific researchers; this is an abstract question.

     My understanding is that siloed social networks no longer give as much access to researchers, so they ask you for (say) your Twitter or Facebook backup data.

   • Embed this notice
     hiker (hiker@social.fedcast.ch)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:26:36 JST hiker

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     @evan
     You didn't tell me what the researchers want to research. I assume that if they want to do research in social media, it's about communication.
     
     So it's about interaction between users. How does research work now if one user has consented but the other has not?
     
     Again, the open, free and decentralized network #Fediverse is not open to such gimmicks. The #Fediverse is not a commercial network where users pay with their data. @feb
   • Embed this notice
     hiker (hiker@social.fedcast.ch)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:55:45 JST hiker

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     • hamiller_friendica
     @hamiller_friendica But then the #Fediverse is dead. @evan @feb
   • Embed this notice
     hamiller_friendica (hamiller_friendica@anonsys.net)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:55:46 JST hamiller_friendica

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou

     @feb Or you can only connect your instance to island networks using a white list.

     @evan

     BeAware :fediverse: repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     feb (feb@loma.ml)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 05:55:47 JST feb

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     @evan From a data protection perspective, this is a rabbit hole. I wouldn't hesitate to close all the nodes if it came to that. That would be far too risky for me.
     As a user of the Fediverse, an essential building block of trust would be lost
   • Embed this notice
     BeAware :fediverse: (beaware@social.beaware.live)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 06:00:20 JST BeAware :fediverse:

     in reply to

     • hiker
     • Evan Prodromou
     • hamiller_friendica

     @Hiker @hamiller_friendica @evan @feb unfortunately it seems like AP is losing lots of trust from its core original users all around with these things for the sake of getting mainstream attention.

     I trust Evan.

     I don't trust the companies that Evan is trusting with the SWF. Most don't.

     I think that's where the issue lies here.

     When you talk about sharing data, it's now always assumed it's for financial gain instead of simple research.

     For me, it depends on what data is requested and if it's anonymized or not.

     I feel okay sharing certain data, as long as its anonymized and nobody will be making a profit off of my data. Strictly research purposes.

   • Embed this notice
     Benj⛤min (sandwich@mastodon.world)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 06:07:20 JST Benj⛤min

     in reply to

     • hiker
     • Evan Prodromou
     • hamiller_friendica
     • BeAware :fediverse:

     @BeAware @Hiker @hamiller_friendica @evan @feb Usually, once the “money men” show up, regardless of how well-intentioned they are, everything goes south.

   • Embed this notice
     BeAware :fediverse: (beaware@social.beaware.live)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 06:39:59 JST BeAware :fediverse:

     in reply to

     • hiker
     • Evan Prodromou
     • hamiller_friendica

     @Hiker @hamiller_friendica @evan @feb well, this is just a simple poll that Evan tends to do every day and nothing may ever come of it in reality.

     In regards to SWF overall, I really believe that they need to be VERY transparent going forward in regards to what is being added or changed and if they'd do something like requiring a specific "feature" in AP developed software/apps.

     As long as they state very clearly what's being added or changed, why, how it works, and if they will "require" it in AP apps going forward, then they can be trusted as far as their word goes.

     Their actual actions and reasonings behind certain things that could be added, would need to be in good faith and not just for the sake of making someone else money.

     If we can monetize our own data, I can see that being something worth looking into, but I don't want someone else to profit without me also profiting.

     From what I understand, Fediverse works by relationships between users and that would be a good way to start a relationship, mutual benefit.

     Overall, I'm very cautiously optimistic and only so because Evan is at the head. I've been here for about a year and a half and seen how he interacts with others and get a feel I understand his goals, even if superficially based on his words.

     I can only wait and see how things work out over time.

     I tend to ramble, so I hope this all makes sense.

   • Embed this notice
     hiker (hiker@social.fedcast.ch)'s status on Friday, 27-Sep-2024 06:40:00 JST hiker

     in reply to

     • Evan Prodromou
     • hamiller_friendica
     • BeAware :fediverse:
     @BeAware
     
     And of the thousands of servers and their admins, who guarantees me “srictly research purposes”?
     I'm always in favor of “Resist the beginnings”.
     
     @hamiller_friendica @evan @feb
     BeAware :fediverse: repeated this.