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1. Embed this notice
   Drew DeVault (drewdevault@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 17:54:25 JST Drew DeVault

   • Phil Betts

   @rahulsiddharthan @philbetts I'm aware of these details, that's not the question -- the point is to critique the presumption of ownership and what's actually happening or changing hands when it's "donated"

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 17:54:24 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • Phil Betts

     @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org @philbetts@mastodon.social Microsoft claims the "new" .NET Core is "open source".
     
     I've never done a deep dive into it, how free is it really?

   • Embed this notice
     Drew DeVault (drewdevault@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 17:54:25 JST Drew DeVault

     in reply to

     • Phil Betts

     @rahulsiddharthan @philbetts if you want to know more about the specific details of the .NET ecosystem, I can sum up my opinion by saying that .NET under Linux was pretty good with Mono until Microsoft decided to care about other platforms (motivated by their failed entry into the mobile market) and turned it into a massive flustercluck

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:02:28 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • Phil Betts

     @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org Then why doesn't a single distro have .NET Core SDK in their official repositories?

   • Embed this notice
     Drew DeVault (drewdevault@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:02:29 JST Drew DeVault

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts

     @SuperDicq @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan it is free as in freedom but requires a CLA

   • Embed this notice
     Drew DeVault (drewdevault@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:04:04 JST Drew DeVault

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts

     @SuperDicq @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan distros do have downstream packages. But it's a nightmare to organize.

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:04:04 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • Phil Betts

     @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org I can't think of a single distro that has downstream packages for this.

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:05:27 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • Phil Betts

     @newt@stereophonic.space @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org 90% of NixOS flakes are garbage proprietary shitware. NixOS is equivalent to Arch AUR or something.
     
     I am talking about actual distros that give a fuck about quality like Debian or Fedora.

   • Embed this notice
     :suya: (newt@stereophonic.space)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:05:28 JST :suya:

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @SuperDicq @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan nixos does
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:10:08 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • Phil Betts

     @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org I don't trust Ubuntu or CentOS as they have no consistent standards on packaging proprietary or blobbed packages.
     
     But considering it is also included in Trisquel I assume it is fine?

   • Embed this notice
     Drew DeVault (drewdevault@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:10:09 JST Drew DeVault

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts

     @SuperDicq @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan https://repology.org/project/dotnet/versions

   • Embed this notice
     Drew DeVault (drewdevault@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:12:27 JST Drew DeVault

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts

     @SuperDicq @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan dude, it's free software

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 18:12:27 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • Phil Betts

     @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org Sorry for being skeptical.
     
     People say the same thing about Electron, or Linux (not libre) or Redis. I just want to be sure.

   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 19:01:46 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • Phil Betts

     @newt@stereophonic.space @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org Yeah I realize now that I'm just being a boomer and .NET Core is apparently free software now.
     
     Back in my day everything that said "dotnet" on it was proprietary as fuck and you had to use Mono instead. But considering that even Trisquel packages .NET Core nowadays I can assume is probably fine.
     
     Debian still hasn't packaged .NET core in their main repository, which is probably why I got confused. Boomer OS for boomer people such as myself.
     
     NixOS still sucks tho.

   • Embed this notice
     :suya: (newt@stereophonic.space)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 19:01:47 JST :suya:

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @SuperDicq @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan first, you're wrong. Second, dotnet is in the main nixpkgs repo.
     
     Gentoo has it too btw
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:50:49 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • Jonathan Dowland
     • Phil Betts

     @jmtd@pleroma.debian.social @newt@stereophonic.space @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social So you're one of those people who believe everyone should just install everything from source?

   • Embed this notice
     Jonathan Dowland (jmtd@pleroma.debian.social)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:50:50 JST Jonathan Dowland

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @newt @rahulsiddharthan @drewdevault @philbetts @SuperDicq I agree with most of what you are saying, but I don't agree with the premise that Debian (or any other distro) should package up the whole universe at all. It was useful in the 20th century when bandwidth was scarce. Now it's wasted work imho
   • Embed this notice
     :suya: (newt@stereophonic.space)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:50:51 JST :suya:

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @SuperDicq @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan more seriously, debian hasn't packaged many things because debian has a huge problem attracting volunteers and refuses to pay its maintainers, despite the org sitting on loads of money. Debian's package infrastracture is arcane and nightmarish. I used to maintain packages for Ubuntu, it has literally the same tooling, and I never wanna touch that garbage ever again. No wonder Debian is lacking software.
   • Embed this notice
     :suya: (newt@stereophonic.space)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:50:52 JST :suya:

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @SuperDicq @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan sounds like debian issue lmao
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:54:18 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • Jonathan Dowland
     • Phil Betts

     @jmtd@pleroma.debian.social @newt@stereophonic.space @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org Repositories with zero to none quality and compatibility control.
     
     Flatpak is very jank and fixing it by just installing every version of every possible dependency is not a good solution even though "it just works".

   • Embed this notice
     Jonathan Dowland (jmtd@pleroma.debian.social)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:54:19 JST Jonathan Dowland

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @SuperDicq @newt @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan not at all. we have a plethora of other repositories today. Flatpak etc etc
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:56:54 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • Jonathan Dowland
     • Phil Betts

     @jmtd@pleroma.debian.social @newt@stereophonic.space @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org Flatpak is one of the better ones if you compare it with Snap or AUR

   • Embed this notice
     Jonathan Dowland (jmtd@pleroma.debian.social)'s status on Wednesday, 28-Aug-2024 22:56:56 JST Jonathan Dowland

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • SuperDicq
     • Phil Betts
     @SuperDicq @newt @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan Flatpak is just one; there are others. It's nice you feel Debian has good quality control. I feel it suffers, precicely from trying to package the universe.
   • Embed this notice
     SuperDicq (superdicq@minidisc.tokyo)'s status on Thursday, 29-Aug-2024 03:17:14 JST SuperDicq

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • Jonathan Dowland
     • Phil Betts

     @newt@stereophonic.space @jmtd@pleroma.debian.social @rahulsiddharthan@fediscience.org @drewdevault@fosstodon.org @philbetts@mastodon.social Nothing right now, as its not there. But already just simply including the dotnet-sdk itself already could be useful for anyone who wants to develop C# software on Debian.

   • Embed this notice
     :suya: (newt@stereophonic.space)'s status on Thursday, 29-Aug-2024 03:17:16 JST :suya:

     in reply to

     • SuperDicq
     • Jonathan Dowland
     • Phil Betts
     @jmtd @rahulsiddharthan @drewdevault @philbetts @SuperDicq you know what in Debian might need .net core? Debian users, like SuperDicq here.
   • Embed this notice
     Jonathan Dowland (jmtd@pleroma.debian.social)'s status on Thursday, 29-Aug-2024 03:17:17 JST Jonathan Dowland

     in reply to

     • :suya:
     • SuperDicq
     • Jonathan Dowland
     • Phil Betts
     @newt @SuperDicq @drewdevault @philbetts @rahulsiddharthan IMHO, one (perhaps the only) valid reason to package .NET Core in Debian would be if something else wanted in Debian needed it. (And wrt this hypothetical downstream dependency, there's an open question about, what *should* go into the OS layer?)