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1. Embed this notice
   iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 16:52:57 JST iced depresso
   furry: :ferret_beg: hello, tox protocol is fucked
   c-toxcore devs: :gutkato_malprofito: we don't intend to do anything about it
   
   well'p.
   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 16:57:09 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @bonifartius guess we're going back to xmpp with the ole privacy plugin
   • Embed this notice
     :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄 (bonifartius@qoto.org)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 16:57:13 JST :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄

     in reply to

     @icedquinn i wonder if there is anything vaguely modern which isn't shit from a protocol perspective.

   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 17:12:34 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @bonifartius i used the thing that came before omemo for a while. i think we only trashed it because omemo is supposed to work with group chats.
     
     not real big on line protocols. i prefer things carry length prefixes :neocat_woozy:
   • Embed this notice
     :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄 (bonifartius@qoto.org)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 17:12:39 JST :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄

     in reply to

     @icedquinn i never got anything except plain text to reliably work with xmpp, expecially file transfers.

     i think the old line based protocols like IRC are residing in a very deep local optimum. everyone tries to replace them, and either it's not really worth it or things are killed by the own complexity.

     only problem IRC has is that E2EE is hard to do within 512 characters ;)

   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 17:34:21 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @bonifartius i shitposted about using OSC for something like this :neocat_woozy:
     
     the ember+ specs are not too bad. they are kind of long, although not entirely without reason. those model everything in the world as a tree though.
   • Embed this notice
     :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄 (bonifartius@qoto.org)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 17:34:25 JST :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄

     in reply to

     @icedquinn nothing wrong with prefixed lines, it's more about how the data is formatted. sonething IRC, SMTP, etc. do seems to be correct.

     unfortunately everything is bloated json now which somehow manages to be even worse than bloated xml.

   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 18:35:51 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @bonifartius they subset BER and then use it to encode a graph of nodes with parameters. seems like a pretty clean way to go actually.
   • Embed this notice
     :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄 (bonifartius@qoto.org)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 18:35:53 JST :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄

     in reply to

     @icedquinn ASN.1 is probably one of the more sane choices for encoding things, yeah. I do like the ascii line protocols though because they are rediciously easy to parse as well, even when they not follow a particular standard.

     ember looks interesting!

   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 20:38:34 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • Iron Bug
     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @bonifartius @iron_bug the xeps are fine. any extensible system that gets actually used will accumulate schemas.
     
     its mostly an issue because the desktop programmers died and all we have now are webshits
   • Embed this notice
     :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄 (bonifartius@qoto.org)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 20:38:37 JST :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄

     in reply to

     • Iron Bug

     @iron_bug @icedquinn i'm increasingly disenchanted with many modern protocols, even if the projects are a good idea.

     e.g. matrix has some nice parts and good ideas, but the protocol is in reality just a moderately good rest api.

     XMPP works fine, but XEP hell killed it.

     i think with many protocols there just are too many moving parts so you always end up with unintended side effects or things not working properly across implementations.

   • Embed this notice
     Iron Bug (iron_bug@friendica.ironbug.org)'s status on Sunday, 18-Aug-2024 20:38:39 JST Iron Bug

     in reply to

     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @icedquinn @bonifartius the most protocols are fine. just people are stupid hiseters sometimes and donàt have enough brain to work with them.
   • Embed this notice
     iced depresso (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Monday, 19-Aug-2024 06:04:40 JST iced depresso

     in reply to

     • Iron Bug
     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @iron_bug @bonifartius
     > well designed
     
     it isn't, though https://github.com/TokTok/c-toxcore/issues/426
   • Embed this notice
     Iron Bug (iron_bug@friendica.ironbug.org)'s status on Monday, 19-Aug-2024 06:04:42 JST Iron Bug

     in reply to

     • Iron Bug
     • :gnu:+bonifartius 𒂼𒄄
     @icedquinn @bonifartius I mean normal IETF RFC protocols, designed by serious engineers. not handcraft by amateurs. ActivityPub is also terrible, because is's just raw and undefined for the most critical cases. but tox is ok, it's well designed and works just fine.