@BowsacNoodle well things are definitely better than they were under trump who added 7 trillion to the national debt but lets not talk about that because repugnitans can't digest it
@EmmaFaber I can talk about it all day, because I'm not a Republican. Austerity or surplus spending are both meaningless when any money that is spent goes towards cronyism. The system is broken. Trump wasn't the solution, Biden isn't, and nothing from the two party cesspool will fix it. The children have no interest in stopping their games at the expense of the wealth and prosperity of our nation and people.
@EmmaFaber But I have a hard time taking anyone seriously who says they live more comfortably under Biden than Trump, economically speaking. Unless you're a trustafarian, that's very unlikely, and even those types had little complain about under Orangeman (although that never stopped them).
@BowsacNoodle@EmmaFaber Bro, this is Emma Faber, she's Kiara levels of horny thinking dudes are thinking about rape 24/7, you're not going to convince her of anything lmao
@jeffcliff@EmmaFaber The unstated condition being these people are already "established". Nobody in my circle was bitching about grocery prices when Trump was in office. Nobody was complaining that they couldn't afford a car (although finding one was tough in 2020). Inflation really do be like that. We can point fingers if we want, but it's the "now" that matters. Nothing under Biden has been positive for the Main Street economy. Austerity was actually done via rate hikes and energy price increases thanks to Russia-Ukraine war. Some of that is downstream of Trump's time in office, but very little is from his policy.
how 'more comfortable' should someone be after 4 years of work, or the better part of 8 years, to do so?
Generally people advance, as they grow older, into more settled places in their society - they develop skills, raise families, sort out problems, move to better places - is it *that* surprising that even in america, with all of its problems, that someone could do so? ( and misattribute their doing so to the federal government, however populated? ). Even in a declining society, with declining standards of living, this would be true for a substantial proportion of its people. At least to a point - if the decline is steep enough this proportion could be vanishingly small, even at the population of 400M level. But is it that steep?
4 years is enough to finish an undergraduate degree. To conceive, birth and raise a 3 year old. To get through 3 unprofitable years as a small business and finally reach the breakeven point of a 4 year plan.
@jeffcliff@EmmaFaber Toilet paper is locally produced because it's lightweight and cheaper to ship and too bulky to store. The shortage was because everyone panic bought a good with basically zero reserve by design. That's not Trump's fault or any other president. And we didn't have food shortages. >Trump wanted to cause inflation The economy was already in a waning phase when he took office. There's merit to the idea that a lot of what went down was effectively short term life support that kicked the can down the road or hid the problem.
>Too far Nothing positive at all. >The fed not Biden Irrelevant because fiscal policy and monetary policy are butt buddies. >Trade agreements See above. Life support. Not to say it was good either. It's also why I don't blame Biden for everything bad that's happening economically, but I can fairly say his recovery attempts suck major ass.
> Nobody in my circle was bitching about grocery prices when Trump was in office.
yeah
only widespread shortages on basic goods like toilet paper and a total breakdown of the price discovery mechanism generally, and people freaking out about whether or not there would be enough food to feed themselves
> Inflation really do be like that.
Sure. But don't forget : trump wanted to cause as much inflation as possible.
Took awhile to get it kicked up a notch, and biden certainly hasn't done as well on that as they could have (or, even as well as canada has)
> We can point fingers if we want, but it's the "now" that matters.
sure
> Nothing under Biden has been positive for the Main Street economy.
That goes too far. He has done a positive thing or two, though plenty of negative to balance it out including but not limited to basically ignoring covid this past and current wave.
> Austerity was actually done via rate hikes
that's the fed doing that not biden
> and energy price increases thanks to Russia-Ukraine war.
this biden does have some responsibility for, and there's going to be more if it goes on -- with the strategic reserve nearing 0
>Some of that is downstream of Trump's time in office, but very little is from his policy.
I would suggest otherwise -- he signed the USMCA and other trade agreements that locked in long-term changes to the US economy. He spun the US into debt that is now costing more than even the us military every year. And, of course, the pandemic still rages -- which started on his watch.
@jeffcliff@BowsacNoodle@EmmaFaber If achieving those goals gets you worse results than it would have 4 years ago, then that's the problem. That's been the case trajectory-wise since the early 2000s.
> According to the 1975 Sinai Interim Agreement signed by the United States and Israel, as a precondition for Israel's return of the Sinai Peninsula and its associated oil reserves to Egypt, in an emergency the United States was obligated to make oil available for sale to Israel for up to five years.[32] Israel has never invoked the agreement [citation needed], however. The agreement was extended in 1979, 1994, 2004, and, most recently, in 2015 for a ten-year period.[33]
next POTUS is going to be in a position to renew this