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   🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 15:42:42 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

   I would love to undertand better the reason/psychology/development of some homosexual men to speak in that distinctive way of speaking that seems exclusive to gay men. Like it isnt an accent, and doesnt seem to occur naturally since its exclusive to that group. Do gay men make it a point to learn to speak that way at some point? If so why?

   My best guess is as a way to show their orientation publicly to signal to other gay men, in an effort to creat connections or find companions that are also gay? But that would imply its a conscious thing they learnedto do at some point?

   PS please no inconsiderate responses. Be respectful people.

   #LGBT #lgbtq

   • Embed this notice
     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 15:58:55 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • Niclas Hedhman

     @niclas

     So that way of speaki g is just somehow attractive to what gay men want? Hmm that would explain why it is hard for me to ubderstand, but makes sense if thats the case.

   • Embed this notice
     Niclas Hedhman (niclas@angrytoday.com)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 15:58:56 JST Niclas Hedhman

     in reply to

     @freemo
     My amateur take; I don't think it is to signal that they are gay, but to make themselves more attractive to some other types or gay men. Speech, mannerism, grooming and fashion in a complete package.

     Some women are doing the same thing to attract straight men that appreciate such.

   • Embed this notice
     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 16:02:51 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • rmx

     @rmx

     If it is something youve noticed occurs before contact with the gay community then that is terribly interesting insight and certainly deepns the mystery for me.

     I have heard other gay men refering to gay men with this style of speaki g as "Queening" if that helps you ubderstand what i mean.

   • Embed this notice
     rmx (rmx@ursal.zone)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 16:02:52 JST rmx

     in reply to

     @freemo I'm curious about that too. I think I know what you mean by "way of speaking" and it happens across many languages and cultures. I wouldn't say it's intentional or a group thing for the most part. Many of us have the same gay "accent" since childhood and in small towns before any contact with other gays and mainstream gay culture. But of course some gay communities have embraced it and maybe enhanced it as an identity marker that may or may not be adopted.

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     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 16:06:32 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • Niclas Hedhman

     @niclas

     Ive talked about it with gays before and most seem curious about what causes it as well. That said i never heard the perspective about it from someone who expresses themselves in that way. Obviously it woukd be awkward to ask directly. Would be awesome if such a person sees this and feels compelled to join in.

   • Embed this notice
     Niclas Hedhman (niclas@angrytoday.com)'s status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 16:06:33 JST Niclas Hedhman

     in reply to

     @freemo

     I am not sure about it, but my simple conclusion from watching my gay brother's friends.

   • Embed this notice
     volkris@qoto.org's status on Monday, 08-Apr-2024 21:34:43 JST volkris

     in reply to

     @freemo well, think about yourself. Do you ever find yourself speaking a different way around certain people as a conscious or unconscious way of relating to them, especially as a positive way of matching them, showing kinship?

     I think that happens to a lot or even most of us.

     We codeswitch as a way of engaging with other humans.

   • Embed this notice
     Louis Ingenthron (louisingenthron@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 00:48:57 JST Louis Ingenthron

     in reply to

     @freemo Much of it is just natural femininity that has been stamped out of most men at a young age. Gender, and its expressions, are a spectrum, but society enforces a strict divide on us and forces us to choose a side.

     What you're seeing are people bucking that trend and living their authentic selves. That's why you also see the distaff counterpart: butch lesbians.

   • Embed this notice
     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 05:50:48 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • Louis Ingenthron

     @LouisIngenthron If that were true im not sure it woukd be exclusive to gay men. It might show a lean towards gay and bi men sure, but it appears pretty much exclusive to gay men.

     It also doesnt strike me as feminin. Like a trans woman who was once male will try to speak in a more feminin tone and that doesnt at all resemble the expression we are describing here.

   • Embed this notice
     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 05:55:36 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • volkris

     @volkris I actually dont but i recognize myself as the exception. Adoping cultural expressions like slang, dialect, accents, fashion styles, or other expressions is something I am strongly averse to. I find it a failing of humans in the genrral sense and not something to adopt.

     For example i am from philly and people ofte remark that i lack a philly accent. My accent is generic and as close to having no accent as one can reasonably get.

     But to your point, i did figure at first it was an adaptation to the expression of the group they are in. But one thing pointed out is that people who express themselves in this way often begin at a youbg age before joining the gay community or even knowing they were gay.

   • Embed this notice
     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 05:56:35 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • DThoris

     @DejahEntendu

     Coukd be. But one pointed out people seem to start doing this before they enter the gay community in a seemingly autonomous way at a you g age. If that is true it would seem its not as simple as that.

   • Embed this notice
     DThoris (dejahentendu@dice.camp)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 05:56:36 JST DThoris

     in reply to

     @freemo
     It's probably less conscious than that. People start to mimic what they hear in order to fit in, like picking up an accent when you move to an area with a different one.

   • Embed this notice
     Louis Ingenthron (louisingenthron@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 06:21:35 JST Louis Ingenthron

     in reply to

     @freemo Oh, it's not exclusive to gay men. There are straight men who use that voice. Usually, they are referred to as "metrosexual". It's just that straight men have *significant* societal pressure to speak "normally" if they want to ever get laid or be employed, whereas gay men have the opposite incentive (at least for the getting laid part). I truly believe that *every* man has that voice inside him... just a matter of how close to the surface it gets.

     As for the thing about trans women: many of them are seeking, above all, to fit in as their new gender, so they tone a lot down. But there are absolutely women (cis and trans) who are every bit as catty as the gayest men. Just watch any reality show on TV, lol.

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     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 06:23:52 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • Louis Ingenthron

     @LouisIngenthron

     That could be. Ive met metrosexuals, usually thry get manicures and body sculpting, but never met one who spoke in that voice. Perhaps its regional as my hometown, even among gays, that way of speaking is nonexistant. I only see it often when traveling. I fact 90% of my exposure to it is probably from male flight attendants whom i only assume (perhaps incorrectly) are gay.

   • Embed this notice
     ampbenzscientist@qoto.org's status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 06:32:26 JST AmpBenzScientist

     in reply to

     @freemo Homosexual men seem to be well-spoken but the level of skill is very impressive. I believe homosexual men tend to be more intelligent than their heterosexual counterparts.

     I can't describe it.

   • Embed this notice
     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 06:33:56 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • AmpBenzScientist

     @AmpBenzScientist generally speaking intelligent people are more likely to go against social norms. So while i dont think being gay means you are more intelligent i do think being openly gay tends to lean towards higher IQ people.

   • Embed this notice
     robryk@qoto.org's status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 07:13:17 JST robryk

     in reply to

     • AmpBenzScientist

     @freemo @AmpBenzScientist

     I think this isn't true without some additional qualification? After all, all petty crime, vandalism, littering, aimless churlishness etc. is against social norms. I think I get what you mean though, but am also missing a term for that kind of social norm contravening.

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     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 07:15:37 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • robryk
     • AmpBenzScientist

     @robryk

     Being against something simply for being a social norm isnt the same as having nonpressure to follow social norms. With theblatter you will still use your discretion but something being against a social norm wont weigh your decision as much as other factors.

     @AmpBenzScientist

   • Embed this notice
     volkris@qoto.org's status on Tuesday, 09-Apr-2024 21:35:19 JST volkris

     in reply to

     @freemo sounds like you prefer to have a generic accent.

     Which is itself the adoption of an accent--a generic one :)

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     🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 (freemo@qoto.org)'s status on Wednesday, 10-Apr-2024 00:31:51 JST 🎓 Doc Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱

     in reply to

     • volkris

     @volkris sure ill tske that. I mean its not that ge eral. Id say its a generalized northen USA accent basically. Even by southern or UK standards its still an accent.