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   Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 01:27:48 JST Evan Prodromou

   One place we lost our way was naming places on Turtle Island "New Something". This is another England, another France, another Spain, another Sweden, we thought. We should bring the same animals and crops from there to here; peel off the surface of home and lay it over this new place, crushing what was underneath.

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 01:31:39 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     I want to get New out of my vocabulary. Don't say New England, don't say Nouvelle France. York, England, Jersey, Zealand, they are their own places.

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 01:33:59 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     I think of what we did here as Euroforming, like how astronauts do terraforming on Mars. It took a lot of work and a lot of time to breed oats and plum trees and pigs that could live here. Changing the animals and plants so they would fit this place.

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:08:54 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • RealGene ☣️

     @RealGene you are not.

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     RealGene ☣️ (realgene@mastodon.online)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:08:55 JST RealGene ☣️

     in reply to

     @evan
     Honeybees too, if I'm not mistaken.

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     Alessandro Corazza (alessandro@mstdn.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:35:45 JST Alessandro Corazza

     in reply to

     @evan To be fair, this went both ways (albeit to a lesser degree). Can you imagine Italy without tomatoes, or eastern Europe without potatoes? Not to mention all the exchanges that happened before the age of sail.

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:35:45 JST Evan Prodromou

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     • Alessandro Corazza

     @alessandro There is a big asymmetry. American crops and livestock were adopted in Europe and Asia, but American people did not mold Italian villages into Andean terraced farms or turn Asia Minor cities into Laurentian longhouse compounds. The pieces were picked and chosen by Europeans, and not shipped as an integrated agricultural/economic/architectural package.

     https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbian_exchange?wprov=sfla1

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:37:03 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • Alessandro Corazza

     @alessandro before sail, as far as I know, only dogs came across the Bering Strait with humans. No other plants or animals. And it wasn't for like 5-10K years after the first humans came. They were like, hey, we forgot something, we should go back.

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     thisisaaronland (thisisaaronland@orthis.social)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:39:01 JST thisisaaronland

     in reply to

     @evan see also: https://aaronland.info/weblog/2017/10/17/things/#nacis

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:39:23 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • alfonso adriasola

     @aadriasola what?

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     alfonso adriasola (aadriasola@ruby.social)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:39:24 JST alfonso adriasola

     in reply to

     @evan Aotearoa bad?

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:52:53 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • alfonso adriasola

     @aadriasola yes, I know. I don't understand why it would be bad. Also, I'm particularly talking about the Americas.

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     alfonso adriasola (aadriasola@ruby.social)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 02:52:54 JST alfonso adriasola

     in reply to

     @evan new zealand, its called aotearoa , usually places prefiixed with New had a local name before

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 03:15:46 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • alfonso adriasola
     • Adriano

     @adriano @aadriasola exactly. Someone should have said, no, you can't have a Braunschweig, we have Braunschweig at home.

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     Adriano (adriano@lile.cl)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 03:15:48 JST Adriano

     in reply to

     • alfonso adriasola

     @aadriasola @evan “Don't say New England, don't say Nouvelle France. York, England, Jersey, Hampshire, they are their own places.” means exactly that: there’s already a York. No need for another.

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     alfonso adriasola (aadriasola@ruby.social)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 03:15:49 JST alfonso adriasola

     in reply to

     @evan its not bad at all, just wondering why the local names should be unused in favor of York which already is in England, never mind

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 03:18:11 JST Evan Prodromou

     in reply to

     • alfonso adriasola
     • Adriano

     @adriano @aadriasola I completely understand that these were all marketing brands because settler colonialism was a pyramid scheme. The king got the land for free, granted or sold it to big lords, who granted or sold it to proto-corporations, who sold it to religious or political dissenters, who actually arrived in what they thought was a carbon copy of Scotland to find out there were already people there.

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     Evan Prodromou (evan@cosocial.ca)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 05:04:45 JST Evan Prodromou

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     • vuñuelo

     @vuneu we should indeed. Although there aren't always matching names for the current borders. Like, nobody had a name for the area from Staten Island to the Adirondacks, west to Buffalo. There are a lot of names for the regions of New York, though.

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     vuñuelo (vuneu@anticapitalist.party)'s status on Sunday, 24-Dec-2023 05:04:47 JST vuñuelo

     in reply to

     @evan Why not just use their names prior to European colonization?