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1. Embed this notice
   Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:11:32 JST Nekobit
   Does anyone know any Linux distros that are pretty stable like Debian but aren't debian? (i hate apt and it's package defaults and stuff)
   
   I want something that feels like a BSD-based distro but isn't rolling like Arch or something.
   
   Slackware was one i looked at but i'd need a slackware user to tell me how slackware is before I just install it. There's CRUX too but I don't see why i'd use that over Arch, as it's also rolling.
   • Embed this notice
     Pleroma-tan (kirby@lab.nyanide.com)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:11:31 JST Pleroma-tan

     in reply to
     @neko probably fedora but stable can mean many things, i'm just assuming you want something that just werks™
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     FrailLeaf (frailleaf@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:14:01 JST FrailLeaf

     in reply to

     • Pleroma-tan
     @kirby @neko fedora is systemd
   • Embed this notice
     Pleroma-tan (kirby@lab.nyanide.com)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:14:01 JST Pleroma-tan

     in reply to

     • FrailLeaf
     @FrailLeaf @neko yes but it's the only thing similar to debian, the system mostly holds up okay
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     Pleroma-tan (kirby@lab.nyanide.com)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:15:59 JST Pleroma-tan

     in reply to

     • FrailLeaf
     @FrailLeaf @neko <strong>not preferred but i don't really care</strong>
   • Embed this notice
     FrailLeaf (frailleaf@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:16:00 JST FrailLeaf

     in reply to

     • Pleroma-tan
     @kirby @neko yeah but neko doesn't want systemd
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     FrailLeaf (frailleaf@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:19:14 JST FrailLeaf

     in reply to

     • Pleroma-tan
     @kirby @neko hmm i read is as "not preferred, i don't care about it"
     Pleroma-tan likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:27:11 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • FrailLeaf
     @FrailLeaf No, IMO programming on a BSD is MUCH better, it's just stuff like VM's, containers, Wayland (WIP on BSD) and even Linux libraries (and stuff like the /sys folder) and its implementations are unique, and arguably, required to program for or poke at, programming Linux is honestly different from "programming UNIX".
     
     Also gaming.
     Sexy Moon likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     FrailLeaf (frailleaf@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:27:12 JST FrailLeaf

     in reply to
     @neko you can't do proper programming on BSD?
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 03:27:14 JST Nekobit

     in reply to
     before you just say "just use BSD", I DO use a bsd (open* and net*), all the time, and I love it; but I need a Linux install for stuff like virtual machines, gameing, and development purposes. Please do tell me.
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     FrailLeaf (frailleaf@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 04:31:16 JST FrailLeaf

     in reply to
     @neko i'm intrigued. which BSD is the mint equivalent in terms of ease of installation? I don't really understand the programming the UNIX way though, is it like "do one thing and do it better, chain them all together and get your shit done" ?
   • Embed this notice
      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 04:31:16 JST 

     in reply to

     • FrailLeaf
     @FrailLeaf @neko TrueOS (formerly PC-BSD) is apparently dead since 2020. Among those that are still alive are MidnightBSD (forked from FreeBSD a long time ago, might be binary incompatible with former as it usually is with BSD flavors) and helloSystem (also FreeBSD-based but synchronizes with stable releases, mimics OS X with its own DE, elementary-eque).
   • Embed this notice
      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 04:34:23 JST 

     in reply to
     @neko CRUX has releases and ports, and uses LTS kernel.
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      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 05:04:01 JST 

     in reply to
     @neko Seems to be as rolling as FreeBSD's stable release. Everything not a part of base system is in ports, wiki claims to use the stable versions of third-party software when possible.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 05:04:02 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • 
     @mint How "rolling" is it though? I don't want something super unstable
   • Embed this notice
     re_l@ryona.agency's status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 05:54:28 JST Re_L

     in reply to

     • 
     @mint @neko
     
     >CRUX
     The base system is also in ports, there's a port called filesystem that creates the / folders. The build script for the iso basically collects all the relevant ports and adds a setup shell script to do the updating/installing.
     It's really meant to be used with any kernel version you want.
     Haven't broken once since I've been using it and due to the tools that it gives you and how it's built, it's really always fixable. The irc is very friendly and active too.
      likes this.
   • Embed this notice
      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 06:02:56 JST 

     in reply to
     @neko Yes, the releases with changelogs are right on the homepage.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 06:02:57 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • 
     @mint Oh that sounds cool. I dont want new packages every week, i just want something like stable release
     
     Do they have "stable" releases though or is it truly rolling?
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 06:32:19 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • 
     @mint ok thank you, sorry im at work. How does it compare to slackware if you know, it seems the package management is similar (looks like all source based).... community not extremely dead btw? Can i contribute ports if i must?
   • Embed this notice
      (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 06:32:19 JST 

     in reply to
     @neko https://crux.nu/Wiki/FaqPortsSystem
     You can make your own port repo and get it listed on the port database. Package management is dead simple with packages being just tarballs with no metadata, though there's also prt-get that handles dependencies.
     https://crux.nu/Main/Handbook3-7
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 07:26:59 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • Pleroma-tan
     • FrailLeaf
     @FrailLeaf @kirby its not that i dont want it, i just have issues with it sometimes. Im more familiar with bsd style init scripts too, so id prefer not to have it if anything, dont need it for a desktop at all
     Pleroma-tan likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     re_l@ryona.agency's status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 15:40:48 JST Re_L

     in reply to

     • 
     @neko @mint
     
     >deps and metadata
     The Pkgfiles have a "depends" field that accepts packet dependencies.
     Prt-get has a "depinst" switch to install the dependencies first.
     It's just that the selection of packages nicely configured with dependencies are those in the official repos and the selection is nowhere as big as gentoo.
     But the packaging system is made in a way that it makes it *very* easy to create your own packages.
     
     The only other metadata are some md5 hashes, a .footprint file that documents all the files in the package so as to avoid conflicts/overwrites, and a package db at /var/lib/pkg/db with the ground truth of all the packages and their files installed in the system with prt-get.
     
     The first time you install it that it will take some time to configure those packages not in the official repos.
     For me it's easier to maintain than any other system I've used because I know exactly how it's built.
      likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 15:40:50 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • 
     @mint hmm.. i dunno, im dead spoiled by gentoo portage and the way bsd handles building by spliting up bins and ports, alongside port dep management. Also no metadata?? i thought it had some custom build scripts. What about patches?
     
     actually after typing this i did look at prt-get, it is compilation based, correct? (no biggie, but i do need to handle deps and upgrades) I just want something that will maintain itself, i don't want to fuck with tarballs by hand
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Friday, 17-Nov-2023 15:41:32 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • 
     • Re_L
     @Re_L @mint that's how bsd build systems work, usually a makefile, its just that nowadays theyve gotten a nice binary repository based on builds which lets you choose between binary packages or building yourself (ports).
     
     I know void linux did this with xbps, but i HATED void linux, so much, and runit was fucking horrible and annoying. Not to mention it was very rolling and barely anyone maintained packages very well. Also its focus on Musl really aped the project (just use a BSD!!!)
      likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Sunday, 19-Nov-2023 09:54:47 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko Slackware, and i am a slackware user.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Sunday, 19-Nov-2023 11:00:16 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc im installing it right now over Crux. I might go with debian on my laptop though, i dont want to maintain much on there but i do want to run some linux software
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Sunday, 19-Nov-2023 11:00:53 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko Cool, if you want to easily use slackbuilds install https://pink-mist.github.io/sbotools/
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 11:43:58 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc i installed slackware and it fucking sucks ass sorry
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 11:43:58 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko Arch users at 10
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 11:46:32 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko I think what i said is very clear, you suck. :alex_lol:
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 11:46:33 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc what
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 11:48:30 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to

     • menherahair
     @menherahair @neko :phear_slackware:
   • Embed this notice
     menherahair (menherahair@eientei.org)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 11:48:32 JST menherahair

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @neko @dcc get slacked
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: likes this.
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:00:11 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko Becuase its very common arch trads get mad.
     >ells you to install everything and if you dont you have to siphon through a million things
     Because its fully fine tuneable, You can install all packages or none of them, imo you really just want to remove through sets.
     >a shit ton of typos and issues in the wiki pages, just seems like a poor distro overall.
     The os has its own docs inside of it, i mean it even comes with its own faq. The wiki pages are fine but some are a bit out of date. If you can't even install it that only speaks of how well you can use a computer.
     >Ah, let me guess, you use Slackware because you don't want systemd
     Many things in fact, no dependency management is my biggest one, bsd rc, slackbuilds, the installer, 32 bit (i dont have anything 32 bit atm though).
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:00:13 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc Are you calling me an Arch user as an insult? (i dont use arch? i wanted a bsd-like distro)... Explain Why this shit has a hacked up installer that tells you to install everything and if you dont you have to siphon through a million things, not to mention a shit ton of typos and issues in the wiki pages, just seems like a poor distro overall. Ah, let me guess, you use Slackware because you don't want systemd or some other retarded nothing reasons that people on the internet / youtube dogshit told you about? Wouldn't surprise me.
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:39:05 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko >gloating that?
     Not a gloat, just a gate that some can't pass.
     >Then why do i need to install another dependency handler called slackpkg+ because i simply want multilib support?
     You dont? :mel_laugh: 5~ lines is all you need
     *
     lftp -c 'open http://slackware.com/~alien/multilib/ ; mirror -c -e 15.0'
     cd 15
     upgradepkg --reinstall --install-new *.t?z
     upgradepkg --reinstall --install-new slackware64-compat32/*-compat32/*.t?z
     *
     >I can turn my debian install into anything by removing apt and building my own tarballs
     Why would i do that when i could install slackware?
     >Slackbuilds??? nigga... how do you think even Arch works lmao
     Slackbuilds are used in arch now? wow thats crazy :columbo_smug:
     >crux
     :crux: I have no problem with crux, but i do prefer slackware.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:39:06 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc I did install slack. Very easy install actually. Painless even. Nothing to brag about even so, why the hell are you gloating that? Never mentioned install issues, just that it sucked when I got it working.
     
     >its fine tunable
     
     Then why do i need to install another dependency handler called slackpkg+ because i simply want multilib support? Sure its fine tunable. I can turn my debian install into anything by removing apt and building my own tarballs. Why do you actually use this piece of shit distro? inb4 dont manage dependencies. Why dont you want to manage dependencies so badly? Why go through the pain of just updating one package and then updating the libraries by hand? Seems tedious and pointless.
     
     Everything you just mentioned as to why you use slackware (32 bit? lmao, literal hack) can be done on any distro ever. In fact most genuine slackware users seem to use it for simplicity and learning purposes but the rest moved on it seems. Crux is like slack but saner and cleaned up to me, hence im installing it. Or ill just go with Debian and pray that Apt doesnt rape me beyond repair. Slackbuilds??? nigga... how do you think even Arch works lmao
     
     >The OS has its own docs inside it
     
     yeah so do many others
     
     If my OS needs a forked dependency handler to be functional than why bother with it. Sounds like an issue with slack itself
   • Embed this notice
     ¢нαяℓιє яσσт :Neon_catto: (charlie_root@decayable.ink)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:39:15 JST ¢нαяℓιє яσσт :Neon_catto:

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc @neko
     
     Did I miss the nerd hellthread?
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:39:15 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to

     • ¢нαяℓιє яσσт :Neon_catto:
     @charlie_root @neko No
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:40:14 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to

     • Nigbot
     • ¢нαяℓιє яσσт :Neon_catto:
     @nice-nigger @charlie_root @neko o
   • Embed this notice
     Nigbot (nice-nigger@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:40:16 JST Nigbot

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     • ¢нαяℓιє яσσт :Neon_catto:
     N :soyjak_excited:
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:59:23 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc >5 lines are all you need
     
     Unless you are wanting to prod for updates and any dependencies. You DO realize that this also replaces all of your system, post install, and basically kind of impurifies the concept of slackware64.... now you have a mess from an (un)official repo. It seems so fragmented when using it. The fact is encourages installing 16gb of everything or "manually prodding through hundreds of tools" is also annoying. Not to mention how slackware groups its default packagebase. I still dont understand why slackware over gentoo or something even. Sure, slackware isnt really a distribution in a "literal" sense, but it hardly feels like a true bsd-like to me in the modern sense, especially when you suggested it to me... those systems have tight-knit communities and packages where as slackware just had 4 types of things scattered and "endorsed" by Pat. Messy.
     
     Slackbuilds ... the repo? I see, but i meant the build system format. There is nothing special or unique about it that I know of.
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:59:23 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko I do mostly use conty for 32bit these days since its easier, i like how slackware has its sets grouped since i can easily remove all the packages i dont need. I just like the build format since its just a bash script. Its bsd likeish, i use openbsd as my daily driver and tbh i do wish it was more like slack.
   • Embed this notice
     ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware: (dcc@annihilation.social)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 12:59:58 JST ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:

     in reply to
     @neko >quick to jump to the conclusion
     Mostly becuase of the angry response, i have helped many people install slackware in fact.
   • Embed this notice
     Nekobit (neko@posting.lolicon.rocks)'s status on Tuesday, 21-Nov-2023 13:00:00 JST Nekobit

     in reply to

     • ✙ dcc :pedomustdie: :phear_slackware:
     @dcc >Just a gate some can't passed
     
     But you sure were quick to jump to the conclusion? It tells me more about yourself if anything. Lots of people especially in sysadmin fields don't have time to actually prod up slackware in production unless they're really bored. Lucky I'm bored, but just because some guy uses Debian or even Ubuntu doesnt mean hes lul epic fail loser linux newfag because he doesnt want to install a billion sources by hand