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Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:48 JST Irenes (many)
@mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine @ShadSterling so a thing to note here is that we see the several recent efforts to distribute containerized apps on Linux as a conflict between ideologies, which is manifesting at the technical level

In conversation about a year ago from mastodon.social permalink
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  linear cannon (linear@nya.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:42 JST linear cannon
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  @irenes@mastodon.social @ShadSterling@mastodon.social @mos_8502@oldbytes.space @tedchoward@mastodon.social @beka_valentine@kolektiva.social
  
  containerizing it often has the same problem: if you containerize it, i'll bet you or your container tool is going to make the assumption that i'm running on an x86_64 computer.
  
  i'm not. i'm running 64-bit little endian powerpc. (yes, it still exists)
  
  so i won't be able to run your container without some nasty hacks on my side.
  
  but if you make your build infrastructure open, if you make the process for building your software something i can go look at (even if it's not properly "open source"), then that means i can go poke at it and make it work for me if something is broken
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
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  linear cannon (linear@nya.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:43 JST linear cannon
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  @irenes@mastodon.social @ShadSterling@mastodon.social @mos_8502@oldbytes.space @tedchoward@mastodon.social @beka_valentine@kolektiva.social
  
  seconded on this.
  
  i maintain packages in some more obscure distros. you will not package your app for my distro, and i do not expect you to. all i want from you is to give me the ability to package and distribute the thing myself, and send you fixes if i run into any issues. i'll do the rest.
  
  in my experience, more often than not, if you try to use some tool or framework or standard that claims to help you target a bunch of things and make it more cross-platform, that actually makes my job harder, because you're not taking away incorrect assumptions your app makes, you're just adding new incorrect assumptions that said framework makes.
  
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  Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:44 JST Irenes (many)
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  @ShadSterling @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine no, but if their goals aren't commercial that's not a problem, because they can just publish the source code and if their thing interests people, distro maintainers will pick it up at some point. or if they want it to happen faster, they can talk to the distro people and find out how to help.
  
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  ShadSterling (shadsterling@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:46 JST ShadSterling
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  @irenes @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine is there an app standard that an Indy developer can target that every user can then install on whatever distro they happen to have? I can’t imagine any Indy developer having the ability to negotiate with hundreds of distros about it
  
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  Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:47 JST Irenes (many)
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  @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine @ShadSterling Linux is organic and messy and different for everyone BY DESIGN, that was the original intent, and it is a lot of what makes Linux good - for a certain concept of "good". a certain concept which gives very little heed to the needs of corporations to save costs.
  
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  Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:47:47 JST Irenes (many)
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  @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine @ShadSterling corporations would prefer to invent entire new app standards rather than integrate with Linux as it is, because containers let them bundle up whatever over-engineered, resource-wasting, privacy-invading schlock they want to foist on the public, without going through that messy process of talking to each distribution's maintainers about what the distro's community needs out of this.
  
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  Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:51:23 JST Irenes (many)
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  @ShadSterling @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine companies that are pushing their app-store-for-Linux things like to talk up how many distros there are as if it's an unimaginable nightmare, but it is NOT that bad.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
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  Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:51:25 JST Irenes (many)
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  @ShadSterling @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine it is also the case that getting your thing into Debian, RedHat, Nix, and gentoo will get it to most people. it's really only a few distros you need to deal with directly because nearly everyone else is downstream from one of those. it just takes a bit longer.
  
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  Irenes (many) (irenes@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:51:26 JST Irenes (many)
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  @ShadSterling @mos_8502 @tedchoward @beka_valentine the problem that app containers solve is only a problem for people who want BOTH a fast turn-around AND to not have to talk to anyone at the distro.
  
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  linear cannon (linear@nya.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Aug-2023 05:52:12 JST linear cannon
  in reply to
  @irenes@mastodon.social @ShadSterling@mastodon.social @mos_8502@oldbytes.space @tedchoward@mastodon.social @beka_valentine@kolektiva.social
  
  this might seem like a niche case, given the past decade and a half or so of computer history. but i assure you it's only going to become more of a concern as time goes on, now that ARM and risc-v are becoming increasingly available for server and desktop uses
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
  Haelwenn /элвэн/ :triskell: likes this.

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