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   Christina Warren (film_girl@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 20-May-2023 13:06:54 JST Christina Warren

   Actively pushing against others to adopt your protocol is how you ensure that your protocol won't "win." I'm a firm believer that a decentralized protocol will be the future of social networks/feeds as we know them. I don't know if it is going to be #ActivityPub or #ATProto or something else. But I believe a decentralized protocol will be the future. But the winner will be the one that centralized-acting services adopt. That's a good thing for everyone. It means users have data portability. 🧵

   • Embed this notice
     Gianni Rosato (gianni@disobey.net)'s status on Saturday, 20-May-2023 13:06:52 JST Gianni Rosato

     in reply to

     @film_girl Opus & Vorbis "were" "bad quality?" Opus has completely taken over for anything real time - Discord & *many* communication apps have adopted Opus. Vorbis is used by Spotify. I don't know who "everyone smart" is, maybe I'm just an idiot

     AV1 is winning largely because it is Google's baby. Development of the reference encoder isn't "open" at all, and their monopolistic influence has caused problems for competing codecs (like JXL for images, which is superior to AVIF) because of Chromium

   • Embed this notice
     Christina Warren (film_girl@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 20-May-2023 13:06:53 JST Christina Warren

     in reply to

     But I'll tell you right now who will not win: the protocol and community that wants to make it as difficult as possible for people to adopt/build-off of and interoperate with. Ogg Vorbis, Opus, and Theora tried to do the whole "open" standard audio and video codec thing. It was bad quality and hard to implement, but “open.” Everyone smart used MP3 anyway. And eventually, MP3 became patent free. Even smarter people started working on things like VP8 and VP9 and HEVC and eventually we have AV1

     Gianni Rosato repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     Gianni Rosato (gianni@disobey.net)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:04:02 JST Gianni Rosato

     in reply to

     • Steve Lhomme

     @film_girl @robUx4 How are you defining “winner?” HEVC has had zero penetration outside the Apple ecosystem, & essentially doesn’t exist on the Web. And AV1 is very much not VP10 - it is built off Daala as well as technologies proposed for VP10. That’s like saying “Opus is essentially CELT, SILK sucks.” I get the point you’re trying to make, but these codec comparisons are wholly uninformed & off base.

   • Embed this notice
     Christina Warren (film_girl@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:04:03 JST Christina Warren

     in reply to

     • Steve Lhomme

     @robUx4 no, you’re correct. Obviously AVC and HEVC are the clear winners, even beyond VP9. But as a royalty free solution, it’s going to be AV1, not Daala or Theora or anything else that doesn’t have the backing of the people that actually do the work and have the users.

   • Embed this notice
     Steve Lhomme (robux4@mastodon.iriseden.eu)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:04:04 JST Steve Lhomme

     in reply to

     @film_girl AV1 is technically VP10 (even on Windows SDK there's some mention of it). I wouldn't say AV1 has won though. Apple still doesn't provide hardware decoding and without hardware encoding it's not practical for most people either.

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     Miguel de Icaza ᯅ🍉 (migueldeicaza@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:06:07 JST Miguel de Icaza ᯅ🍉

     in reply to

     @film_girl All three protocols you mentioned were developed after mp3 existed as alternatives that people could use without the licensing cartel - and I don’t think implementation difficulty was the problem at all (they are OSS), or even quality.

     Mp3 remained used by pure market inertia dynamics.

   • Embed this notice
     Gianni Rosato (gianni@disobey.net)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:07:35 JST Gianni Rosato

     in reply to

     • Naman

     @film_girl @nmn Yeah, it was unfortunately a very weak analogy because it was almost entirely incorrect. I don’t even hate your initial point, but as someone who actually understands multimedia codec technology, you ruined your message.

   • Embed this notice
     Christina Warren (film_girl@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:07:36 JST Christina Warren

     in reply to

     • Naman

     @nmn You’re probably right and I regret the analogy now b/c my mentions are full of very angry Ogg fans (who knew!) but I still stand by the overall point!

   • Embed this notice
     Naman (nmn@indieweb.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 00:07:43 JST Naman

     in reply to

     @film_girl Did not see that comparison coming! I don’t think the Theora people were nearly as dogmatic and stupid as the people pushing against Big Tech on the Fediverse.

   • Embed this notice
     Christina Warren (film_girl@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 08:06:00 JST Christina Warren

     in reply to

     • Guy English

     @Gte And that's the thing -- the best thing doesn't win -- the one that is easiest for others to build off of is what wins!

   • Embed this notice
     Guy English (gte@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 08:06:01 JST Guy English

     in reply to

     @film_girl BSD was embroiled in legal BS when Linux came along and took off.

     @reiver ⊼ (Charles) :batman: repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     @reiver ⊼ (Charles) :batman: (reiver@mastodon.social)'s status on Sunday, 21-May-2023 09:16:00 JST @reiver ⊼ (Charles) :batman:

     in reply to

     • Guy English

     @film_girl @Gte

     I don't know how you feel about them, but —

     Neither ActivityPub, etc or AT-Protocol, etc seem like simple protocols to me.

     And, although I've seen worse documentation — the documentation for both seem very poor to me.