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   R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 01:13:08 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

   So, Evolution just got an "upgrade" to #ClientSideDecorations. Ugh! I run a wm instead of a de for a reason! I want my wm to draw my titlebars. Considering jumping ship to #Thunderbird, but it has a significantly larger footprint. Also, I'm not crazy about my emails spawning #WebKit processes, spawning #gecko processes would be worse. #TechnoCurmudgeon

   • Embed this notice
     array :java: :void: :php: (array@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:07:55 JST array :java: :void: :php:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛

     @RL_Dane @fedops TBH I knew this existed because I came into it a while ago, but until your comment made me remember it again, I haven't found any mention elsewhere... Is really nobody using it? And if so, why is that? It seems like it's still maintained and pretty up to date (last beta was launched on August 31...) :(

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:07:57 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • array :java: :void: :php:
     • fedops 💙💛

     @array @fedops

     RIGHT! Much like the T1000, old Mozilla gradually came back together! X"-D

     I think it's based on Firefox ESR, though, so it's probably not as simple as `cat firefox.c thunderbird.c chatzilla.c > seamonkey.c` lol

   • Embed this notice
     array :java: :void: :php: (array@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:07:58 JST array :java: :void: :php:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛

     @RL_Dane @fedops Now that you mention it... SeaMonkey still exists? https://www.seamonkey-project.org/ ;)

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:07:59 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛

     @fedops
     Yeah, and it used to be one program: Mozilla was the browser, email/newsreader, and IRC.

   • Embed this notice
     fedops 💙💛 (fedops@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:04 JST fedops 💙💛

     in reply to

     @RL_Dane yeah, just checked on Fedora. Pretty similar. 275MB for Thunderbird versus 11MB for Evolution.

     That's what happens when you package up a complete web browser for html emails. ?

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:05 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛

     @fedops
     Man it's got *lots* of deps (but they're direct deps, probably unlike evolution)

     https://hastebin.com/asobawazuw

   • Embed this notice
     fedops 💙💛 (fedops@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:06 JST fedops 💙💛

     in reply to

     @RL_Dane holy shit. Is that pulling in all of KDE?

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:08 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛

     @fedops
     Ehhh…
     $ pacman -Qi evolution $(pacman -Qi evolution{,-data-server} |grep ^Depends.On |cut -f2 -d:) |grep -i ^installed.size |sed -E 's/ [0-9]{1,3}\.[0-9]{2} KiB/ 1 MiB/g' |awk '{foo+=$4} END {print foo" MiB"}'
     478.72 MiB

     $ pacman -Si thunderbird $(pacman -Si thunderbird |grep ^Depends.On |cut -f2 -d: |sed 's/=[^ ]*//g') |grep -i ^installed.size |sed -E 's/ [0-9]{1,3}\.[0-9]{2} KiB/ 1 MiB/g' |awk '{foo+=$4} END {print foo" MiB"}'
     [omittiing random "package asdf.so not found"]
     34104.9 MiB

   • Embed this notice
     fedops 💙💛 (fedops@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:09 JST fedops 💙💛

     in reply to

     • Paul Wilde

     @RL_Dane @paul ok. Though there might be a bunch of dependencies as well?

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:10 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛
     • Paul Wilde

     @fedops @paul

     Installed size.

     ~ $ pacman -Si evolution thunderbird |grep -iE "^(Name|Installed Size)"
     Name : evolution
     Installed Size : 77.14 MiB
     Name : thunderbird
     Installed Size : 193.38 MiB

   • Embed this notice
     fedops 💙💛 (fedops@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:11 JST fedops 💙💛

     in reply to

     • Paul Wilde

     @paul @RL_Dane that's interesting. I always thought Evolution was the bloatier one of the two. Are you comparing package size or memory use at runtime?

   • Embed this notice
     Paul Wilde (paul@notnull.click)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:08:22 JST Paul Wilde

     in reply to
     @RL_Dane whut!? You telling me when I upgrade Evolution it's going to look and feel rubbish in a WM? Damndamndamndamn
     I've considered a move to Thunderbird but I feel the same as you, it's much heavier... hmpf
   • Embed this notice
     array :java: :void: :php: (array@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:09:14 JST array :java: :void: :php:

     in reply to

     • fedops 💙💛

     @RL_Dane @fedops Includes newsgroup and feed client and IRC... That comes straight from the time machine, for sure. ;) In fact, I just have downloaded it and made a test run... It *looks* pretty outdated (and too many bars!), which doesn't really matter, but that's what it is. Main problem I found is that finding a suitable adblocker may be difficult, ublock isn't there. It reminds me of Pale Moon a bit, a bloated Pale Moon indeed. ;)

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Tuesday, 06-Sep-2022 12:09:15 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • array :java: :void: :php:
     • fedops 💙💛

     @array @fedops

     Well, the question should be, why?

     It makes sense to separate such disparate projects as a web browser and email client, except that they both rely on the same code to display html -- but in the days of extreme sandboxing, each window has its own process, anyway.

   • Embed this notice
     R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd: (rl_dane@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 07-Sep-2022 02:18:56 JST R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

     in reply to

     • charadon@fossto-:/ # :t_blink:

     @Charadon

     They're not horrible, but outside of Gnome, they're very jarring.

     It's just so dadgum unnecessary. Mutter can draw the blaster bars.

     #GNOME is constantly playing the power grab game, and I'm sick of it.

     Nobody wants to be Unix anymore (openness, utility, usability, interoperability), they all want to be MacOS (consolidated control, like-it-or-lump-it, one grand master vision ?)

     I'm so done with the *ego* of these projects.

   • Embed this notice
     charadon@fossto-:/ # :t_blink: (charadon@fosstodon.org)'s status on Wednesday, 07-Sep-2022 02:19:01 JST charadon@fossto-:/ # :t_blink:

     in reply to

     @RL_Dane My unpopular opinion is that I think the new CSD looks pretty cool =P (Seriously though, Adwaita's title bars are way to thick, they need to make it more compact)