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   HalvarFlake (halvarflake@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 30-Mar-2023 02:49:51 JST HalvarFlake

   Given the actual recycling rates for almost anything non-compostable, I sometimes wonder if the entire term is just a big PR opération.

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     Sindarina, Edge Case Detective (sindarina@ngmx.com)'s status on Thursday, 30-Mar-2023 02:49:46 JST Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

     in reply to

     @HalvarFlake Yeah, that’s what cradle to cradle design is about, essentially. There's already quite a few vendors doing it, voluntarily, but they sort of get drowned out by everyone else who just goes for the cheapest bidder.

     One big step forward would be to require that the vendor recycle their product within the country it is sold in, in such a way that it cannot be re-re-re-exported and eventually end up somewhere on a burn pile in Africa or South East Asia.

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     HalvarFlake (halvarflake@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 30-Mar-2023 02:49:47 JST HalvarFlake

     in reply to

     • Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

     @sindarina perhaps the trick is really regulation that prescribes that product vendor need to provide full-cycle recycling paths, including minimal uptake quotas, with serious fines for missing quotas.

     We design for manufacturability all the time, but rarely for recyclability.

     Valerie Aurora repeated this.
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     Sindarina, Edge Case Detective (sindarina@ngmx.com)'s status on Thursday, 30-Mar-2023 02:49:48 JST Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

     in reply to

     @HalvarFlake Cardboard and paper can just be recycled into new cardboard and paper, it doesn't need to be composted.

     But yeah, battery recycling is still in its early days, although there's slowly enough of a market to do it, with some real development that makes it feasible, profitable, etc.

     I'm pretty sure precious metals are already profitable, even outside of vendors like Apple, but is still rather 'dirty’, because so many vendors don't keep track of re-exports, if they even have a collection program to begin with.

     Which is why I get annoyed at headlines highlighting Apple this, Apple that, allowing everyone else to duck ?

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     HalvarFlake (halvarflake@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 30-Mar-2023 02:49:49 JST HalvarFlake

     in reply to

     • Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

     @sindarina actually this is a great point. My original tweet was specifically triggered by abysmal data on plastics an Li-Ion battery recycling.

     Glass & metals is indeed a success, cardboard & paper is long-term compostable so excluded from my initial complaint.

     Regarding precious metals from electronics, or more broadly electronics recycling: This is super heterogeneous iirc? E.g. apple has invested heavily in recycling / disassembling robots, but most smartphone...

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     Sindarina, Edge Case Detective (sindarina@ngmx.com)'s status on Thursday, 30-Mar-2023 02:49:50 JST Sindarina, Edge Case Detective

     in reply to

     @HalvarFlake Yes, on some levels, but also no? Like, it very much depends on where you live, but in most European countries, recycling actually works, and works quite well.

     Glass, for example. Aluminium. Paper and cardboard. Quite a few plastics. Recovery of precious metals from electronics is competitive. And so on.

     The biggest problem, at least for plastics recycling, which is what people mostly refer to when they say that recycling doesn't work, is that virgin plastics are too cheap, and thus the market for recycled craters every time oil prices go down.

     But that is slowly also being adressed through legislation.