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Notices

  1. Embed this notice
    admin (admin@mastodon.tech)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 00:07:01 JST admin admin
    • Eugen Rochko

    Final thoughts how to improve #Mastodon from ex-Twitter Designer Jon Bell @gargron

    “I want to share some thoughts as an ex-Twitter designer and someone who’s been on Mastodon since 2018.

    1/ I was lucky enough to soak in Twitter’s data for years. So I could see what features people actually responded to, and which we just assumed they’d respond to.

    Buckle up, I have some interesting news that you, as a Mastodon user, are going to disagree with.

    People don’t like reverse-chron timelines. (head explodes)

    Let me explain myself. 2/ As a Mastodon user, you’re waaaaaay more likely than the average user to love reverse-chron with no algorithm. It’s one of the main selling points for Mastodon!

    But it’s not rooted in what we saw in seemingly hundreds of different #designresearch findings.

    The reason Twitter almost died so many times at the start is that normal people aren’t looking for an IRC or RSS experience. So people joined, got frustrated, and left.

    It took THREE YEARS to turn users into “healthy users.” That’s bad.

    3/ Designers love talking about #empathy , but it can be hard to walk the walk. What do you do when literally 97% of your users are saying “I don’t like trying to curate a good timeline, and I don’t like having to scroll to keep up with everything, and I feel like I’m missing out on the good stuff, and I’m confused?”

    Bad designers say “Deal with it.”

    Good designers say “Hm. This is a problem to solve.”

    And that’s where algorithmic timelines, guide, moments, editorial content, etc came from.

    4/ I remember when we moved from strict reverse-chron (which 97% struggle with) to “You might like” prompts (which 3% struggle with) and hearing from the VERY LOUD minority that we were destroying Twitter.

    But we saw as the 97% had a much better time. We saw that every step forward we took (I have a whole presentation on this) was helping people more and more.

    The data told us we were making a better product. And that reverse-chron kinda sucks. For most people.

    5/ I remember when we added quote tweet, and we have the receipts. It does not increase abuse. (Source: I was the lead designer on the abuse team)

    You know what increases abuse? Reverse-chron replies without any sorting or algorithm, because someone can say “Kill yourself” as the first response. It becomes a game. It silences people.

    6/ My team rolled out mute keywords, which people SCREAMED at us about, saying it was killing the concept of “just show me everything” Twitter.

    Victims of abuse, who aren’t nearly as loud, thanked us quietly.

    We rolled out “hide replies” which almost caused an internal riot, and was shelved for three years, but eventually it went live.

    Again, some people said we were killing Twitter. Again, they were wrong.

    7/ Mastodon is exciting for a ton of reasons. I love it. I want it to succeed. But … have you read Animal Farm?

    As Mastodon grows up, and tries to reach beyond the early adopters, please listen to your users.

    They’ll guide you to some features that cannot be optional in a system like this. And, sorry, a lot of them will feel like traditional Twitter.

    #inconvenienttruth Not because people have baggage, but because humans are going to human and certain things are inevitable. Good luck with everything. I hope sharing some of these opinions and experiences helps the fediverse in some small way.

    I’m rooting for you. Goodnight. https://social.lot23.com/@jon

    #mastodon #twitter #ux #design #critique #hashtags

    In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 00:07:01 JST from mastodon.tech permalink

    Attachments

    1. Domain not in remote thumbnail source whitelist: left.it
      HOME
      from Left Redazione
    2. Domain not in remote thumbnail source whitelist: sociallot23.files.fedi.monster
      Jon Bell (@jon@social.lot23.com)
      49 Posts, 36 Following, 1.59K Followers · http://lot23.com
    • Embed this notice
      Stephanie Eller (seller11@mstdn.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 01:20:02 JST Stephanie Eller Stephanie Eller
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko

      @Gargron @admin Well, I always set my Twitter timeline to display the latest tweets anyway, so I’m fine.

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 01:20:02 JST permalink
      admin likes this.
    • Embed this notice
      Fulkery1 (fulkery1@mas.to)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 01:20:45 JST Fulkery1 Fulkery1
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko

      @admin @Gargron I agree vehemently with everything but the quote tweet. I think that could stay gone and while it may not have seemed to increase abuse, I don't think any good comes of it. I blocked most people who quote tweeted me on that dying site. The rest? Agreed, thoroughly agreed.

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 01:20:45 JST permalink
      admin repeated this.
    • Embed this notice
      Just Russ (tracyrussellblack@mstdn.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 01:39:24 JST Just Russ Just Russ
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • Fulkery1

      @fulkery1 @admin @Gargron I don't miss quote tweets at all. Larger accounts use them to have their followers dogpile someone they disagree with. #TwitterMigration

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 01:39:24 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      Paul Wilde (paul@notnull.click)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:00:24 JST Paul Wilde Paul Wilde
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • Paul Wilde
      @admin @Gargron Joking aside, I think there's one critical flaw in the entire argument: Unlike Twitter, we have compatible alternatives.
      Mastodon is popular because it works well, the features are right for the majority of people. Those that want different features have found out about Pleroma or Misskey, or any other alternative with features that are more in-tune with what they want and have migrated over. Twitter has not had this, so trying to apply corporate case studies for improvement logic is flawed right from the start.
      Stop trying to make the Fediverse something it isn't!!!!

      /rant :blobsmilehappyeyes:
      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:00:24 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      Paul Wilde (paul@notnull.click)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:00:27 JST Paul Wilde Paul Wilde
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      @admin @Gargron

      TL:DR: "Hi, I used to work for Twitter, and I'm here to fix Mastodon"
      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:00:27 JST permalink
      admin repeated this.
    • Embed this notice
      admin (admin@mastodon.tech)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:03:05 JST admin admin
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • かわいい川獺

      Not quite, he’s mostly against Mastodon’s current reverse chronology

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:03:05 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      かわいい川獺 (kawaiiuso@outpoa.st)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:03:07 JST かわいい川獺 かわいい川獺
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      >Twitter employee demands decentralized becomes centralized
      I didn't even read it I'm just expecting it
      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:03:07 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      admin (admin@mastodon.tech)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:58:52 JST admin admin
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • かわいい川獺

      AFAIK, Twitter shows it in chronological order as replies show below the original

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:58:52 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      かわいい川獺 (kawaiiuso@outpoa.st)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:58:53 JST かわいい川獺 かわいい川獺
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      As in newest tweets first? Isn't that Twitter's way too?
      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 02:58:53 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      dungbeetle (dungbeetle@toot.community)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 06:05:18 JST dungbeetle dungbeetle
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • Paul Wilde

      @paul @admin @Gargron excuse the corporate jargon, i’m still deprogramming from big social ?

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 06:05:18 JST permalink
      admin likes this.
    • Embed this notice
      Paul Wilde (paul@notnull.click)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 06:05:20 JST Paul Wilde Paul Wilde
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • dungbeetle
      @dungbeetle @Gargron @admin I don't know, I have issues with the words "traction" and "audience" to be honest, they simply don't sit right with me in this context.
      "audience" gives a vibe of "listen to me, I am your hero", and "traction" sends signals of "hey, don't miss out on this!"
      Maybe I'm the only one, but the fact those things don't exist here make me think otherwise (ignoring the technical reasons why they don't exist here)
      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 06:05:20 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      dungbeetle (dungbeetle@toot.community)'s status on Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 06:05:21 JST dungbeetle dungbeetle
      in reply to
      • Eugen Rochko
      • Paul Wilde

      @Gargron @admin @paul I’m conflicted about this because although it would be nice to see toots that are gaining traction, what I’ve really enjoyed in my short experience on mastodon is the flatness of it. It helps me see more unique content from users that don’t have a huge audience. What’s being suggested is making the site stickier which has lead to shitty outcomes on other social platforms.

      In conversation Thursday, 24-Nov-2022 06:05:21 JST permalink
    • Embed this notice
      GNU Too (gnu2@gnusocial.jp)'s status on Saturday, 26-Nov-2022 08:12:41 JST GNU Too GNU Too
      in reply to
      • Fulkery1
      @fulkery1 there's more than enough other platforms on the Fediverse that support "quote share" like GNU Social and Friendica, that Mastodon doesn't need to. That's the brutal of Free Software, the marketplace if ideas and federation
      In conversation Saturday, 26-Nov-2022 08:12:41 JST permalink
      Fulkery1 likes this.

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GNU social JP is a social network, courtesy of GNU social JP管理人. It runs on GNU social, version 2.0.2-dev, available under the GNU Affero General Public License.

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