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   Erik Uden 🍑 (erikuden@mastodon.de)'s status on Saturday, 22-Feb-2025 16:03:34 JST Erik Uden 🍑

   What defines a mistake from deliberate harm is how you respond to criticism.

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     Erik Uden 🍑 (erikuden@mastodon.de)'s status on Saturday, 22-Feb-2025 16:54:05 JST Erik Uden 🍑

     in reply to

     However, doesn't that mean that progressives benefit from things like racism, the patriarchy, and ableism as done as harshly as within the far right, because it makes us trivialize our own discrimination?

     Jesse 🇫🇷 likes this.
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     Erik Uden 🍑 (erikuden@mastodon.de)'s status on Saturday, 22-Feb-2025 16:54:06 JST Erik Uden 🍑

     in reply to

     This isn't about anyone in particular, by the way. I was just interested in what progressives think is the right way to go about recognizing honest mistakes in a time where we have far right to fascist public figures, who will proudly not own up to horrible things and be hailed for this indifference by their subjects, but also scandals within progressive circles. We often let supposed progressives get away with many bad things, simply because they do the bare minimum, as it's way better than what the far right does.

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     Erik Uden 🍑 (erikuden@mastodon.de)'s status on Saturday, 22-Feb-2025 16:54:08 JST Erik Uden 🍑

     in reply to

     By definition, obviously, it does not. However, since we cannot look inside someone's head, the only thing we as outsiders can distinguish between the two is how honest someone is in dealing with the fallout of whatever it is that they did.

     If they deny it being a mistake and would do the same once again, it's very clear that it was on purpose and consistent within some ideological framework.

     If they simply use terms like “I am very sorry” or ask for forgiveness, but only as a means to an end to move on and regain support, to continue business as usual, then they're also not sorry.

     When they can understand the ramifications of their actions, can reflect upon themselves to a degree where their change isn't also just a weapon to distance themselves from their mistake, and can hence accept other people's dislike for them despite that change, and most importantly show the appropriate accountability for their own actions (which, in the case of a public figure, could mean stopping being that entirely) then I agree that what they've done is something that they are sorry for.

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     Chris Hessert 🐧 🇺🇦 (chessert@mastodon.online)'s status on Sunday, 23-Feb-2025 01:33:34 JST Chris Hessert 🐧 🇺🇦

     in reply to

     @ErikUden

     Apologies have to be given the same way true gifts are given: without any expectation of reward (forgiveness).

     If you're expecting a transaction, you're definitely not doing it right.

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     Erik Uden 🍑 (erikuden@mastodon.de)'s status on Sunday, 23-Feb-2025 01:33:35 JST Erik Uden 🍑

     in reply to

     As theoretical it all is, I think the main factors should always be:

     You should not expect to be forgiven, and the only people who can decide whether they forgive you, are the victims of your actions.

     Because when people apologize expecting to be forgiven and all their actions to be undone, it's once more not an apology, but a means to an end.

     GreenSkyOverMe (Monika) repeated this.
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     Erik Uden 🍑 (erikuden@mastodon.de)'s status on Sunday, 23-Feb-2025 01:33:36 JST Erik Uden 🍑

     in reply to

     Furthermore, doesn't the attempt of trying to find the “one right way” to do an apology, like I just did, just create a path or “get out of jail free” card, that anyone could use to do wrong things and then strategically follow?