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   Graeme Arthur (graemearthur@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 22:37:49 JST Graeme Arthur

   • Tom Capuder

   @tomcapuder knowing an outcome doesn’t necessarily mean causing it. For example, I might know my kid will choose to wear their favorite shoes tomorrow, but that doesn’t mean they lack the freedom to choose differently. God’s omniscience surely works similarly except he knows perfectly —it’s knowledge of free choices, not their cause. Does being fully known scare you?

   • ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ repeated this.
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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 22:37:49 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     in reply to

     @graemearthur

     You keep talking about "God’s omniscience" and "God knows every choice you will freely make," but how do you even know that God even exists? Even if your argument about God knowing what choices you make not taking away your free will is true, it doesn't really mean anything if you can't prove the existence of the God you're talking about.

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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 22:54:13 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     in reply to

     • Caspar
     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     @cbontenbal @TimWardCam @graemearthur

     Physicalism states that everything that exists is either physical or dependent on physical things. If it's outdated, then someone must have proven that something exists that isn't physical or dependent on physical things. Has anyone done that?

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     Caspar (cbontenbal@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 22:54:14 JST Caspar

     in reply to

     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE
     • ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     @TimWardCam @Radical_EgoCom @graemearthur Physicalism is outdated.

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     Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE (timwardcam@c.im)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 22:54:16 JST Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     in reply to

     • ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     @Radical_EgoCom @graemearthur As far as we know "free will" isn't a thing as there is no physical mechanism that can deliver it.

     The usual way out of this seems to be to say "in practice it's too complicated to calculate what someone will decide to do, so we might as well live our lives as if free will is actually a thing".

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     Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE (timwardcam@c.im)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 23:05:19 JST Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     in reply to

     @Radical_EgoCom @cbontenbal @graemearthur I suspect the reference is to today's post-facts political climate, in which case your request for "proven" is also irrelevant.

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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 23:05:46 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     in reply to

     • Caspar
     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     @TimWardCam @cbontenbal @graemearthur

     No, they're referencing the philosophical view of physicalism, which states that everything that exists is either physical or is dependent on the physical.

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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 23:26:43 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     • Caspar
     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     @cbontenbal @TimWardCam @graemearthur

     Can you answer my question?

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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Wednesday, 27-Nov-2024 23:34:40 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     • Caspar
     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     @cbontenbal @TimWardCam @graemearthur

     Your answers will convince me if it's backed by empirical evidence, but I assume based on your response that no one has ever proven something to exist that isn't dependent on it physical objects or is physical.

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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 28-Nov-2024 05:33:52 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     • Caspar
     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     @cbontenbal @TimWardCam @graemearthur

     My claim, specifically, is that everything that has ever been examined is either physical or has derived from the physical and nothing that humans ever examined has ever been proven to derive from something that isn't physical.

     I'm not claiming that things can not derive from a non-physical source, but that there is no proof that things can derive from a non-physical source, and therefore, there is no rational reason to believe it.

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     ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭ (radical_egocom@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 28-Nov-2024 05:58:17 JST ☭ 𝗖 𝗔 𝗧 ☭

     • Caspar
     • Tim Ward ⭐🇪🇺🔶 #FBPE

     @cbontenbal @TimWardCam @graemearthur

     I was simply correcting you on what my actual claim is. That's my rational reason.