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   screwlisp (screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 13:47:50 JST screwlisp

   Despite ample evidence to the contrary, #Ilive (hmm, if I were also #evil, that would be a pallindrome as well as a visual collision)
   Fascinating (if I do say so) #lispgames #gamejam #gamedev #retrospective on #itch_io
   https://lispy-gopher-show.itch.io/lispmoo2/devlog/834615/princess-revisited
   I am enormously happy with the
   { verb [ dobj [ prep iobj ] ] } x
   language dynamic, and how it shares your #lisp #repl, and their concerns are just... Different so they don't collide.
   I guess I get my #languageDesign friends a little better now.
   Thoughts?

   • Embed this notice
     screwlisp (screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 16:19:34 JST screwlisp

     in reply to

     • DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄)
     • Daniel Kochmański

     @dougmerritt
     I thought about cowardly walking myself back, but then I threw this spaghetti at your wall instead:
     https://lispy-gopher-show.itch.io/lispmoo2/devlog/834651/itches-of-mine-lispmoo2-scratches
     Finishing the joke comparing MOO + lisp to the objective realities of C++ + smalltalk left as an exercise to the reader
     @jackdaniel
     I have been a bit nervous about what you think of my exuberant use of your command-table work...
     On topic though, I guess I will eventually use clim completions. Atm neither slime nor anything else is doing completions.*Oops 1/2

   • Embed this notice
     Daniel Kochmański (jackdaniel@functional.cafe)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 16:19:35 JST Daniel Kochmański

     in reply to

     • DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄)

     @dougmerritt @screwtape technically common lisp has both unnamed and keyword arguments, although the latter can't be specialized in standard generic functions.

     There's also that many editors provide the function signature as a hint when you edit a function invocation; I don't know how this would work like with messages though.

     screwlisp repeated this.
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     DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄) (dougmerritt@mathstodon.xyz)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 16:19:37 JST DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄)

     in reply to

     @screwtape
     I'm not quite sure why that makes you enormously happy, but as a language designer, I can share a related observation:

     Programmers seem to me to do better with tools that let them use approximations of natural language. For instance, in the Smalltalk language, it was/is very common to have method named arguments marked with things like "WithHelpOf:" -- markers of prepositions and so on.

     Languages with unnamed arguments, like Common Lisp, C, etc, can be dealt with because we have big brains, but somewhat less naturally.

     screwlisp repeated this.
   • Embed this notice
     screwlisp (screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 16:22:17 JST screwlisp

     in reply to

     • DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄)
     • Daniel Kochmański

     @jackdaniel
     Actually, currently unused, every lispmoo2 - object is associated to an ungrafted clim pane I stuck in their symbol-value. (Ie it's sitting there unused as an in-memory extended stream). I imagined that these would serve a role in broadcasting updates using sudo-output-replaying and 2D GUI rendering, but that's very not here nor there yet.
     @dougmerritt

   • Embed this notice
     screwlisp (screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 16:27:18 JST screwlisp

     in reply to

     • DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄)
     • Daniel Kochmański

     @dougmerritt
     (And sorry about the sudden spam)
     On the topic of natural language, there was a technical discussion I lost somewhere; I think I've erroneously attributed it to Yib (of ygm) before.
     The problem is seen here:
     The MOO language *only* (broadly) has this:
     verb [ direct-object [ preposition indirect-object ]]
     This works quite well, a lot of the time but then there's this:
     In my 'game':
     talk princess
     talk is the verb, princess is the direct-object. But this is anti-NLP. 1/2
     @jackdaniel

   • Embed this notice
     screwlisp (screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Saturday, 16-Nov-2024 16:30:06 JST screwlisp

     in reply to

     • DougMerritt (log😅 = 💧log😄)
     • Daniel Kochmański

     @dougmerritt
     In contrast, in the lambda RPG in lambda moo, the first place people normally encounter it is when they turn on the N64 and reality shifts them into a first person experience with Zelda.
     In my antecedents/betters' case, they magicked the MOO rule into this:
     talk to Zelda
     By defining the verb to *only* take a direct-object, which is a string (everything after the verb), and then custom parsing whatever that got.
     But now the user needs to learn a language for every verb
     @jackdaniel