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   Aral Balkan (aral@mastodon.ar.al)'s status on Friday, 17-May-2024 17:34:39 JST Aral Balkan

   This is great but can we please also have Fedora (& Ubuntu, etc.) acknowledge they started shipping operating systems without a functional screen reader when they switched to Wayland and that that’s still the case?

   This is not to name to shame. Unless we acknowledge this as an error on par with shipping without monitor support and unless the culture is altered to make accessibility a showstopper, it’ll happen again.

   #Fedora #GAAD #Accessibility #A11y #Linux #OpenSource https://fosstodon.org/@fedora/112450335722898487

   • Embed this notice
     Philip McGrath (liberalartist@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 18-May-2024 13:14:37 JST Philip McGrath

     in reply to

     @aral AFAIK all of the major distros still support using an X session, even if Wayland is the default, so screen reader users and others with needs not yet met by Wayland can still use X, right?

     (This is not to detract from the importance of accessibility!)

   • Embed this notice
     Aral Balkan (aral@mastodon.ar.al)'s status on Saturday, 18-May-2024 13:14:37 JST Aral Balkan

     in reply to

     • Philip McGrath

     @LiberalArtist Sure, yes. And since that is apparently a perfectly valid workaround, I suggest that – in solidarity, and until screen reader support lands in Fedora, Ubuntu, and any other distribution that ships with Wayland by default – we remove monitor support from Wayland (those whose needs are not met by lack of monitor support in Wayland can still use X).

   • Embed this notice
     Aral Balkan (aral@mastodon.ar.al)'s status on Saturday, 18-May-2024 17:35:30 JST Aral Balkan

     in reply to

     • Philip McGrath

     @LiberalArtist All I’m saying is that if you believe that, then shipping with Wayland without monitor support is also different than “operating systems without functional monitor support.” (Unless your point is that there are different criteria for what is acceptable for sighted people – which, clearly, is the case because those operating systems are shipping with monitor support by default but without screen reader support.)

   • Embed this notice
     Philip McGrath (liberalartist@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 18-May-2024 17:35:31 JST Philip McGrath

     in reply to

     @aral Again, I agree that accessibility is of utmost importance and that cultural changes are needed to emphasize it from the beginning. I just think systems that need some non-default configuration for a functional screen reader are importantly different than "operating systems without a functional screen reader".

     Both X and Wayland have limitations that in some use-cases make them not viable. Until Wayland catches up, we each get to decide if we prefer Wayland's bugs or X's bugs.