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   Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 09:58:23 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

   • NEETzsche
   • BillingtonYVR
   He admitted he was wrong here.
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 09:58:22 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR

     Well, unfortunately for him, his W is going to be turned into an L of a much more, ah, serious form. Normally, I wouldn’t be so harsh, but this time, he earned it. In previous posts, he claimed that all heretics (in that they oppose the Orthodox / Catholic churches) go to hell. However, he is a Lutheran, which is an explicitly listed heresy.

     This places him in a very tough predicament. Either, he admits, in his next post:

     • He is hellbound. This is the default choice if he doesn’t respond in 30min or fails to choose the other option, or
     • He is theologically wrong and illiterate, and that I was ultimately correct all along. He apologizes, explicitly, for his retarded, extreme hostility. He is placed in a subordinate position for 1 year, where his capacity to graduate into my peer in the future is evaluated by me, unilaterally.
   • Embed this notice
     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 09:59:23 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     You almost had it.
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 09:59:23 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR

     No. I have it. He makes a choice in the next 30min.

   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:01:20 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR

     That would be unfortunate for him.

   • Embed this notice
     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:01:21 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     What if he has diarrhea and doesn't use his demon box phone to post?
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:07:13 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR

     he blocked me

     lmfao, looks like he’s going to go to hell, per his own position

   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:14:22 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     Honestly it’s more about being willing to agree to disagree until someone gets aggressive and cunty. Then they have to be right, or it’s time to shut their faggot ass down.

   • Embed this notice
     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:14:23 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     Old world schizm. If no one has fixed it yet I don't think that these two will.
   • Embed this notice
     BillingtonYVR (billingtonyvr@eveningzoo.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:14:24 JST BillingtonYVR

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     What the fuck is wrong with you two?
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:24:58 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     Would be nice to get over sectarian bullshit. If you want the context of me and opphunter’s shit, I basically argued that Valentinians and other Gnostics count as Christians, and that Orthodoxy’s appeal to the apostolic line etc is bunk. He basically went on this BLAGHGGHGH YOU ARE A HERETIC, YOU ARE HISTORICALLY AND THEOLOGICALLY ILLITERATE, FUCK YOU NIGGER shtick that gradually built up over a couple of days.

     But also, like, he’s a Lutheran, which is explicitly recognized as a heresy by the very church he was appealing to. The hypocrisy, hostility, and just plain incorrectness of his overall view, which spilled over into other contexts, has led me to want to gg no re him for a while, and now that I have, I’m satisfied.

   • Embed this notice
     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:24:59 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     We need to have a good solid old crusade and get Christianity on the same page again. We could start in London.
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:27:32 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     Well, I don’t buy into the wacky Yaldabaoth Sophia cosmologies but this idea that some council can just decide, unilaterally, which books do and do not count as scripture is only practical as a political tool. It’s basically meritless beyond that. But to insist on cleaving to such an institution, except when they feel like breaking from it, is just the height of hypocrisy and I will admit it stuck in my head.

   • Embed this notice
     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:27:33 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped
     Gnostics are crazier than Mormons.
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:33:03 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     My honest take on Gnosticism is that it has some key points that are correct. Most notably, they have these things right:

     • Secret knowledge is real
     • Some council can’t decide what is and is not scripture
     • The devil controls the world and does play a rather demiurgic role
     • This world is pretty hellish

     I don’t buy the Yaldabaoth Sophia shit but it’s not like they were completely bereft of correct takes.

   • Embed this notice
     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:33:04 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped
     But the books the Gnostics wrote specifically contradict the Bible, and not in little ways like the Gospels or Enoch.
     
     The entire Demiurge concept almost makes them an entirely different religion.
   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:39:49 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     You can get all four of these ideas from the canonical books but in practice Orthodoxy/Catholicism tries to pump the brakes on taking these ideas seriously because frankly, they do lead toward a more Gnostic view.

   • Embed this notice
     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:39:50 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped
     The world is controlled by the devil but you can gather that from the canonical books.
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     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:48:13 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     Isn't the commonly held belief more that the world is "influenced" by the devil or have we gotten into a time period where "controlled" should be accepted?
     
     At which point one asks is there still free will or are more people possessed than not possessed, bothered or not bothered, under the control of unclean spirits or only nudged along, goaded into their own ultimate damnation?
     NEETzsche likes this.
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     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 10:48:13 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     The devil repeatedly gets referred to as the ruler of this world and etc. There are also passages about how he got cast down to Earth. The overall thrust, going by the accounts in the canonical scriptures, is not that decent people lack free will as much as they are the underdog. I think Eph 6:12 captures this best but you see this stuff all over the place elsewhere.

     I’d characterize this as something that slipped through the cracks of the councils’ editing process. Because when you take this stuff seriously and internalize it, it really does lead to Yaldabaoth Demiurge Sophia Hylic Pneumatic type thinking, although perhaps not using their platonized phraseology.

   • Embed this notice
     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:05:24 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     Gnosticism is completely incoherent on basically everything because it isn’t a unified religious movement. Early Orthodox Christians tried to paint it as one, but it just wasn’t. It was a bunch of disparate sects that had some recurring themes, but that’s it. On top of that, a lot of Gnostics had some outright batshit ideas so there’s that lol.

     That being said, here are some more quotes about how the devil controls the world. I can also give verses about how the kingdom of heaven is not found on Earth.

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     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:05:26 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     OK this is a great big logical fallacy on my part and I realize that absolutely, but I am very curious and enjoying this conversation a lot, no bullshit.
     
     But wouldn't "rulers of the darkness of this world" imply there is also light or even rulers of light in this world?
     
     Does gnosticism say that the devil is the ruling force on the earth?
     
     I know I should research these things before going this deep into a conversation.
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     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:06:00 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped
     My understanding is that Lucifer and his minions have dominion over the earth but God and the angels occasionally intervene to remind people there is hope and that Satan is a niggerfaggot. Through him you can be saved.
     
     Gnostics believe that Lucifer/Demiurge has FULL control over the world, and that he created it instead of God, and that the only way out is through self improvement through secret knowledge and enlightenment.
     
     That was at least my take away and why I'd hesitate to call them Christians.
     NEETzsche likes this.
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     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:25:19 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     Honestly I do the thing that infuriates people the most and I take an unironically Gnostic view, where I just read the damn document and decide for myself not just if it’s true, but which parts of it are true, and in what sense they’re true. And my argument for it really does boil down to OPEN YOUR THIRD EYE BREH, PIERCE THE VEIL BRO. It’s infuriating to people because I’m cherry picking to their and am not apologizing for doing so. I think part of it is because it’s hard to hold my feet to the fire on Talmudic gotcha arguments because, the way I unironically view this stuff is that everything I read is prepended with “consider the following:”

     So do I accept Christ as the Savior, and all that? Absolutely. Do I think that my salvation is tied to my stature in some church? No. Or that some authority can decide which documents and which parts of them are and are not true, and I am obligated to acquiesce to that? No. Or that they can decide what appropriate conduct is? No.

     Churches are legitimate, until they aren’t.

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     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:25:20 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     Evangelical churches/pastors would say something about the devil lying and being the father of lies and therefore what he promised to Jesus in the Temptation wasn't his to give but I don't know if there are supporting biblical references. I was raised in an evangelical doctrine but that is not my church anymore.
     NEETzsche likes this.
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     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:25:27 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped
     I was raised Southern Baptist and it was always presented to me as a constant cold war between God and Satan over who controls what, that there is good and evil in the world but the evil almost always outweighs the good, and that in the end Satan will control all of it. That's when Christ returns.
     NEETzsche likes this.
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     NEETzsche (neetzsche@iddqd.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:37:27 JST NEETzsche

     in reply to

     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped

     Pretty much every church is flawed in some way or another. I was thinking of making a series of memes to do denomination war trolling. Basically they would be formatted like this. Side by side comparison:

     “Christianity” (my denomination) ||| Your Denomination By Name (insinuation that it’s not really Christianity)

     On the left side just insert a bunch of peculiarities of My Denomination as matter of fact. The ones on the right are of course taken in the most parsimonious light possible, made to look ridiculous. But you would need to do permutations on this. “Christianity” (Orthodoxy) vs Lutheranism. “Christianity” (Lutheranism) vs Orthodoxy. “Christianity” (Mormonism) vs Lutheranism. And the list goes on and on. BUt you just omit the part where “Christianity” is just “my denomination.”

     Then just throw these things in people’s faces. It would be hilarious but I think people out there would take it seriously.

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     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:37:28 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     They also believe the gifts of the Pentecost include gibbering and gyrating all over the church. It's a difficult doctrine to understand once you are outside of it or if you actually read the Bible.
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     Psychotic Militant Bitch (silverwolf@nicecrew.digital)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:37:30 JST Psychotic Militant Bitch

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     • MisterRogersSnapped
     I don't dislike Pentecostals but it is interesting that they and Methodists seem to be the ones the propagate the "Satan in Hell" thing. No one is in Hell right now, assuming Hell is the Lake of Fire.
     
     If Hell = Sheol then maybe?
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     MisterRogersSnapped (misterrogerssnapped@seal.cafe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Sep-2023 11:37:31 JST MisterRogersSnapped

     in reply to

     • NEETzsche
     • BillingtonYVR
     Pentecostals believe that ultimately the Lord has already cast Satan into Hell, that all creation exists to worship God and that while a war is coming, God has already won and while Satan can influence man that man can choose correctly and that Satan has no real power, only the power you give him. Pentecostal churches are one big "Carman" music video with less production value.
     
     https://youtu.be/5qSiQhms-lA?si=iJgKcBEIvkJNQmad